Re: [Hubmib] FW: [802.3.1_MIBS] FW: 802.3.1-2011 ApprovalNotification

"C. M. Heard" <heard@pobox.com> Wed, 20 July 2011 01:08 UTC

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From: "C. M. Heard" <heard@pobox.com>
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To: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" <dromasca@avaya.com>
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Cc: Hubmib <hubmib@ietf.org>, David Harrington <ietfdbh@comcast.net>, "Bert \(IETF\) Wijnen" <bertietf@bwijnen.net>
Subject: Re: [Hubmib] FW: [802.3.1_MIBS] FW: 802.3.1-2011 ApprovalNotification
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Dan,

Waiting until after the IETF meeting to run the proposal past the 
IESG sounds quite reasonable.

If the IESG is open to the proposal, it seems to me that a 
widely-announced IETF last-call should suffice.  My suggestion would 
be to cc: the last call announcement to the hubmib, ietfmibs, 
ops-area, and (possibly) opsawg lists (besides of course 
ietf-announce, where all such things appear).

Thanks

Mike

On Tue, 19 Jul 2011, Romascanu, Dan (Dan) wrote:
> Hi Mike, 
> 
> I think that everybody who expressed opinions in this thread agreed with
> your suggestion to mark the said RFCs as Obsoleted by IEEE 802.3.1 ...
> We also seem to agree that if possible we would do it by an IESG
> decision, avoiding the extra cost of writing an RFC. I am not sure yet
> that the IESG will accept this proposal, and I hesitate to run it in the
> busy week before the IETF meeting. 
> 
> Question - do we need to run this beyond the hubmib list? A one-slide
> presentation in the OPSAREA meeting for example? 
> 
> Thanks and Regards,
> 
> Dan 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: C. M. Heard [mailto:heard@pobox.com]
> > Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2011 11:37 PM
> > To: Romascanu, Dan (Dan)
> > Cc: Bert (IETF) Wijnen; David Harrington; Hubmib
> > Subject: RE: [Hubmib] FW: [802.3.1_MIBS] FW: 802.3.1-2011
> > ApprovalNotification
> > 
> > Greetings,
> > 
> > David Harrington and Glenn Parsons both provide good reasons why the
> > status of the IETF Bridge MIB modules should remain unchanged.
> > 
> > My question, however, concerned the Ethernet-related MIB modules in
> > RFCs 2108, 3621, 3635, 3637, 4836, 4837, 4878, and 5066.  The
> > situation for those is different.  New versions (rooted under
> > different OIDs) have been published in IEEE Std 802.3.1, and the
> > overview section of that document says that it "supersedes and makes
> > obsolete" those RFCs.
> > 
> > Mike Heard
> > 
> > On Tue, 19 Jul 2011, David Harrington wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > As I recall, when we did the transfer, it was agreed that the IETF
> > > Bridge MIBs would continue to be standards (i.e. not be obsolete or
> > > historic), and the defined compliance levels would continue to be
> > > valid for those who wished to comply only to the IETF standards.
> > >
> > > IEEE had an interest in extending the IETF MIB modules in ways that
> > > were not backwards compatible, such as totally modifying indexes to
> > > existing tables in order to support per-provider(?) discriminators.
> > > IETF Bridge MIBs have been widlet deployed in enterprise
> > environments,
> > > and many of those environments had no desire to move to the
> > > per-provider approach that was/is important to service providers.
> > >
> > > Allowing the continuation of the IETF compliance as a valid option
> > > addressed this difference in perspective.
> > >
> > > I suppose one could draw a parallel with the RADIUS/Diameter split
> > and
> > > co-existence for different environments.
> > >
> > > dbh
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Romascanu, Dan (Dan) [mailto:dromasca@avaya.com]
> > > > Sent: Monday, July 18, 2011 3:35 PM
> > > > To: Bert (IETF) Wijnen; C. M. Heard
> > > > Cc: Hubmib; David B Harrington
> > > > Subject: RE: [Hubmib] FW: [802.3.1_MIBS] FW: 802.3.1-2011
> > > > ApprovalNotification
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Hi,
> > > >
> > > > I am not sure, I need to consult with the IESG, as the issue of
> > > > a non-IETF document obsoleting an IETF document may be rather
> > > > new. I see that we did not make such a note on RFC 4188, when
> > > > work was transferred to the IEEE 802.1WG. I am copying DBH who
> > > > wrote RFC 4663.
> > > >
> > > > To be clear - we are talking only about the meta-data for these
> > > > RFCs, not about changing their status to Historic (for which the
> > > > procedure is described by an IESG statement -
> > > >
> > > > http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/designating-rfcs-as-
> > historic.html)
> > > >
> > > > Thanks and Regards,
> > > >
> > > > Dan
> > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: hubmib-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:hubmib-bounces@ietf.org]
> On
> > > > > Behalf Of Bert (IETF) Wijnen
> > > > > Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2011 11:24 PM
> > > > > To: C. M. Heard
> > > > > Cc: Romascanu, Dan (Dan); Hubmib
> > > > > Subject: Re: [Hubmib] FW: [802.3.1_MIBS] FW: 802.3.1-2011
> > > > > ApprovalNotification
> > > > >
> > > > > On 7/16/11 5:24 PM, C. M. Heard wrote:
> > > > > > Dan,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > This new IEEE standard was published on July 1, 2011.  Since
> it
> > > > > > includes updated versions of the MIB modules defined in RFC
> > 2108,
> > > > > > RFC 3621, RFC 3635, RFC 3637, RFC 4836, RFC 4837, RFC 4878,
> and
> > RFC
> > > > > > 5066, a question arises: would it be appropriate for the meta-
> > data
> > > > > > for these RFCs to indicate that they are obsoleted by IEEE Std
> > > > > > 802.3.1?
> > > > >
> > > > > Not sure if the RFC-editor can do or normally doies this.  Dan,
> > do you
> > > > > know.
> > > > >
> > > > > If not, I guess we could write 1-2 page RFC that obsoletes the
> > listed
> > > > > RFCs with a
> > > > > pointer to the IEEE document.
> > > > >
> > > > > Bert
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Mike Heard
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Sun, 22 May 2011, Romascanu, Dan (Dan) wrote:
> > > > > >> FYI.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Regards,
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Dan
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> -----Original Message-----
> > > > > >> From: Howard Frazier [mailto:hfrazier@BROADCOM.COM]
> > > > > >> Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2011 12:06 AM
> > > > > >> To: STDS-802-3-MIB@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
> > > > > >> Subject: [802.3.1_MIBS] FW: 802.3.1-2011 Approval
> Notification
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Dear Members of the IEEE 802.3.1 Ethernet MIB modules Task
> > Force,
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> The initial version of P802.3.1/D3.1 Standard for Management
> > > > > Information Base (MIB) definitions for Ethernet has been
> approved
> > as an
> > > > > IEEE standard. See below. Congratulations and thanks to all of
> > you for
> > > > > your work on this project.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> A PAR for a revision of the standard is on the agenda for the
> > June IEEE-SA Standards Board meeting.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> We will hold a short meeting next Thursday afternoon in
> > conjunction
> > > > > with the IEEE 802.3 interim meetings in Incline Village, NV, to
> > plan
> > > > > our work for the revision project.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Howard Frazier
> > > > > >> Chair, IEEE 802.3.1 Ethernet MIB modules Task Force
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> -----Original Message-----
> > > > > >> From: Law, David [mailto:dlaw@hp.com]
> > > > > >> Sent: Friday, May 20, 2011 12:05 PM
> > > > > >> To: Howard Frazier
> > > > > >> Subject: FW: 802.3.1-2011 Approval Notification
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Hi Howard,
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> On checking I found that I did have the approval
> notification.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Congratulations!!
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Best regards,
> > > > > >>    David
> > > > > >> _______________________________________
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> From: k.evangelista@ieee.org [mailto:k.evangelista@ieee.org]
> > > > > >> Sent: 17 May 2011 14:28
> > > > > >> To: Law, David
> > > > > >> Cc: p.nikolich@ieee.org; K.Bennett@ieee.org;
> > k.breitfelder@ieee.org;
> > > > > thompson@ieee.org
> > > > > >> Subject: 802.3.1-2011 Approval Notification
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> 17 May 2011
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> David Law
> > > > > >> HP Ltd.
> > > > > >> 20 Clayknowes Ave
> > > > > >> Musselburgh, East Lothian EH21 6UR
> > > > > >> Scotland
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> cc:          Paul Nikolich, Sponsor Chair
> > > > > >>          Kathryn Bennett, Program Manager
> > > > > >>                Kim Breitfelder, Manager Standards Publishing
> > > > > >>          Thomas Geoffrey, Negative Balloter
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> RE: NEW P802.3.1/D3.1 (C/LM) Standard for Management
> > Information
> > > > > Base (MIB) definitions for Ethernet
> > > > > >> Dear David,
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> I am pleased to inform you that P802.3.1 was approved as a
> new
> > > > > standard by the IEEE-SA Standards Board on 16 May 2011. A copy
> of
> > the
> > > > > document will be forwarded to the Standards Publications
> > Department.
> > > > > The editor assigned to work on the project will contact you.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> All IEEE standards shall be updated within five years of
> > approval by
> > > > > the IEEE-SA Standards Board. If the standard is not revised,
> > > > > reaffirmed, or withdrawn within five years, the Sponsor will be
> > > > > notified that it will be submitted to the Standards Board for
> > > > > administrative withdrawal.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> It should be noted that any negative balloters have the right
> > to
> > > > > appeal. Please consult the following web pages for information
> on
> > this
> > > > > process:
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> http://standards.ieee.org/develop/policies/bylaws/
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> http://standards.ieee.org/develop/policies/opman/
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Please contact me if you have any questions prior to
> > > > speaking with
> > > > > your editor.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Sincerely,
> > > > > >> ************************************************
> > > > > >> Karen M. Evangelista
> > > > > >> IEEE - SA Governance, Administrator
> > > > > >> IEEE Standards Activities Department
> > > > > >> 445 Hoes Lane
> > > > > >> Piscataway, NJ 08854-4141 USA
> > > > > >> TEL: +1 732 562 3854
> > > > > >> FAX: +1 732 796 6966
> > > > > >> k.evangelista@ieee.org
> > > > > >> *************************************************
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> _______________________________________________
> > > > > >> Hubmib mailing list
> > > > > >> Hubmib@ietf.org
> > > > > >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hubmib
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Hubmib mailing list
> > > > > Hubmib@ietf.org
> > > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hubmib
> > > >
> > >
>