Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling?
"Shelby Moore" <shelby@coolpage.com> Mon, 16 August 2010 00:50 UTC
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Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 20:51:25 -0400
From: Shelby Moore <shelby@coolpage.com>
To: Greg Wilkins <gregw@webtide.com>
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Cc: hybi@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling?
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> On 16 August 2010 10:24, Shelby Moore <shelby@coolpage.com> wrote: >>> On Sun, Aug 15, 2010 at 07:03:05PM -0400, Shelby Moore wrote: >> We must have that fallback no matter what we do. All options forward >> have >> failure cases. >> >>> If I had the choice, I'd rather go for >>> WS/TLS with a quick fail to WS/HTTP. >> >> >> WS/HTTP can fail at random times after that quick fail, you still need >> Comet/BOSH. > > and Comet/BOSH can fail at random times. > All solutions need to handle the fact that the internet can fail silently. > > I do not think it is possible to design a system that will always fast > fail, other than an explicit declaration by a participant that a > protocol is not supported. It is impossible to design a handshake, > whose success will guarantee the delivery of a subsequent websocket > message . > > The only real evidence of a protocol working is the protocol working. > The level of confidence in the protocol will be determined only by > mechanisms built into the protocol: messages, keep-alives, ping/pongs > and any extensions for acknowledgements etc. > > There is no silver bullet. Strong point, but won't the WS/port+tunnel (over TCP or equivalent) only fail-to-deliver and never corrupt, whereas WS/HTTP could corrupt the data (and will not support some data types at all, need encryption)? Also WS/HTTP is likely to fail more often during data transfer (after initial handshake) given reasonable robust networks. So they are not equivalent failure costs.
- [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Willy Tarreau
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Willy Tarreau
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Willy Tarreau
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Willy Tarreau
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Willy Tarreau
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Willy Tarreau
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Vladimir Katardjiev
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Vladimir Katardjiev
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Willy Tarreau
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Adam Barth
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Adam Barth
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Dave Cridland
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Salvatore Loreto
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] New port and Tunneling? Shelby Moore