[hybi] Is there a traffic jam?
Mark Lentczner <markl@lindenlab.com> Mon, 13 April 2009 18:12 UTC
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From: Mark Lentczner <markl@lindenlab.com>
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Date: Mon, 13 Apr 2009 11:13:24 -0700
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Subject: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam?
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On Apr 11, 2009, at 7:27 PM, Greg Wilkins wrote: > BEEP! > ... > BEEP! > ... > BEEP! > ... > BEEP! As pointed out, BEEP has many attributes that make is seem a likely candidate for this space. But, to summarize (and add to) the points against it: Seems that each request/response would need its own BEEP channel. This is because of the synchronous nature of BEEP channels(*). Channel creation is mid-weight, but at least requires a round-trip before the actual request could even begin. It might be possible to encode the request within the channel creation request, but there is a 4k payload limit for such messages. BEEP requires both XML and MIME parsers. Note that BEEP messages are not equivalent to HTTP messages. BEEP has no address (URL) or method for the messages, and the headers of BEEP are MIME, whereas the headers of HTTP are not. One could imagine using the message/http MIME type to an HTTP message as the payload within a BEEP message. But then you'd need XML, MIME and HTTP parsers... This personally doesn't bother me, but it is getting rather heavyweight for something small. There is no addressability in BEEP for channels or messages. I see two ways two add one to a profile: 1) Add the address (and perhaps method) as fields in the initialization message on channel create. This would require a new channel for every request. 2) Encode the address in each message (see above for using message/http) Some unclear aspects: The overhead of BEEP seems like it would greater, though I admit I haven't calculated it. I doubt it would be outrageous. I don't know enough to know if flow control internally would be needed. If so, BEEP has it. If not, it is a little scary to implement! I think one could shoe-horn into BEEP via Upgrade with a little careful draftsmanship. Defining a fall-back mechanism might be considerably more difficult, as BEEP is considerably more general. Lastly, we did consider BEEP about a year ago. The biggest thing against it was that libraries didn't seem widely available. I realize there is a chicken and egg thing here, but since BEEP didn't appear to really hit our use case dead on, we didn't feel like we'd be the best candidates to encourage its library development. - Mark (*) There is a current draft addressing this: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-thomson-beep-async-02 Mark Lentczner Sr. Systems Architect Technology Integration Linden Lab markl@lindenlab.com Zero Linden zero.linden@secondlife.com
- [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Mark Lentczner
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Thomson, Martin
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Thomson, Martin
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Paul Prescod
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Rob Sayre
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Mario Balibrera
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Paul Prescod
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Paul Prescod
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Sylvain Hellegouarch
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? S. Mike Dierken
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? S. Mike Dierken
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Sylvain Hellegouarch
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Sylvain Hellegouarch
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Anne van Kesteren
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Maciej Stachowiak
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Anne van Kesteren
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Sylvain Hellegouarch
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Anne van Kesteren
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Sylvain Hellegouarch
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Sylvain Hellegouarch
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Mario Balibrera
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Mike Dierken
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Maciej Stachowiak
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Mike Dierken
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Sylvain Hellegouarch
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Sylvain Hellegouarch
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Mark Lentczner
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Paul Prescod
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Paul Prescod
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Thomson, Martin
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Paul Prescod
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Paul Prescod
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Thomson, Martin
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Paul Prescod
- Re: [hybi] Is there a traffic jam? Greg Wilkins
- [hybi] How to define the WebSocket protocol (Was:… Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] How to define the WebSocket protocol (… Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] How to define the WebSocket protocol (… Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] How to define the WebSocket protocol (… Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] How to define the WebSocket protocol (… Pieter Hintjens