Re: [hybi] WebSocket over HTTP2 is discussed on httpbis

Yutaka Hirano <yhirano@chromium.org> Fri, 14 March 2014 12:46 UTC

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Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2014 21:46:15 +0900
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From: Yutaka Hirano <yhirano@chromium.org>
To: Peter Thorson <webmaster@zaphoyd.com>
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Subject: Re: [hybi] WebSocket over HTTP2 is discussed on httpbis
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>
> I have some more detailed comments about fleshing out that particular
> draft. Should those be posted here or on the httpbis thread?

Please feel free to post on the httpbis thread.

Thanks,


On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 8:40 PM, Peter Thorson <webmaster@zaphoyd.com>wrote;wrote:

> The gist of the draft proposal [2] would be acceptable to me. I believe
> there are some performance regressions with respect to RFC6455 but likely
> none that will be of consequence for a big chunk of the WebSocket user base
> and for any users that do run into them the solutions seem straight forward
> (throw more hardware at it or use RFC6455).
>
> I have some more detailed comments about fleshing out that particular
> draft. Should those be posted here or on the httpbis thread?
>
> On Mar 10, 2014, at 0:13, Yutaka Hirano <yhirano@chromium.org> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> As I announced before, WebSocket over HTTP2 is discussed on httpbis.
> Though tunneling is widely supported in HiBy, httpbis people don't like it
> and I failed to persuade them.
> Currently there are two proposal [1] and [2].
> [2] maps a WebSocket message to HEADERS + DATAs HTTP2 frames and it
> doesn't preserve RFC6455 semantics.
> For Tobias and Peter, I would show how [2] meets your design priorities
> given before.
>
> Tobias's priority:
>
>> 1. allows to provide W3C WebSocket API
>>
> Yes.
>
>> 2. no "80%-WebSocket-protocol-compatible" design (either compatible with
>> full RFC6455 incl. any extensions or outright independent of WS)
>>
> Yes, 0% RFC6455 Frame compatible (though I would like to  reuse some
> handshake stuff).
>
>> 3. does not put servers that provide both native WS and SPDY (but not any
>> SPDY/WS) on same origin at a disadvantage
>>
> It doesn't depend on the framing problem.
>
>> 4. minimizes code coupling between WS and SPDY within implementations
>
> No, though the mapping is simple.
>
> Peter's priority:
>
>> Important:
>> 1. W3C WebSocket API and muxing go without saying.
>>
> Yes.
>
>> 2. Dedicated RFC6455 connections remain a viable option in modern
>> browsers.
>>
> Yes.
>
>> 3. Efficient and clearly defined method for detecting HTTP/2.0 messaging
>> support, choosing HTTP/2.0 vs raw RFC6455, when to fall back, etc.
>>
> It doesn't depend on the framing stuff.
>
>> 4. Payload compression with appropriate configurability (either via
>> permessage-deflate support or a native mechanism)
>>
> it is possible.
>
> Nice to haves:
>> 5. Avoid significant regressions from RFC6455 in wire overhead, latency,
>> and per message fixed costs for very small (<100byte) messages.
>>
> I think there is no significant regressions.
>
>> 6. Clean spec/avoiding redundant and unnecessary features of RFC6455.
>>
> Yes.
>
>> Only if it doesn’t conflict with 1-6:
>> 7. Options for future compatibility with simple RFC6455 extensions
>
> No.
>
>
> And, protocol negotiation should be also discussed.
> In fact, it has more impact on the HTTP2 spec and we should provide
> feedback to them as soon as possible if any (See [3] for example).
> Please join discussions on http2bis if you have any comments.
>
> Thanks,
>
> [1]:
> https://github.com/yutakahirano/ws-over-http2/blob/master/draft-hirano-websocket-over-http2.txt
> [2]:
> https://github.com/yutakahirano/ws-over-http2/blob/master/ws-over-http2-message-mapping.md
> [3]: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-nottingham-httpbis-alt-svc-03
>
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