Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844-bis-01
Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie> Sun, 10 February 2019 02:34 UTC
Return-Path: <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
X-Original-To: iasa20@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: iasa20@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])
by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D09212785F;
Sat, 9 Feb 2019 18:34:22 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -4.301
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.301 tagged_above=-999 required=5
tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1,
DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001]
autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key)
header.d=cs.tcd.ie
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44])
by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024)
with ESMTP id ISUO8MOoMkPa; Sat, 9 Feb 2019 18:34:19 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mercury.scss.tcd.ie (mercury.scss.tcd.ie [134.226.56.6])
(using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits))
(No client certificate requested)
by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3DD47127133;
Sat, 9 Feb 2019 18:34:18 -0800 (PST)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])
by mercury.scss.tcd.ie (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B36ABE38;
Sun, 10 Feb 2019 02:34:14 +0000 (GMT)
X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at scss.tcd.ie
Received: from mercury.scss.tcd.ie ([127.0.0.1])
by localhost (mercury.scss.tcd.ie [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024)
with ESMTP id 6Lugd_rc7IMy; Sun, 10 Feb 2019 02:34:13 +0000 (GMT)
Received: from [10.244.2.138]
(95-45-153-252-dynamic.agg2.phb.bdt-fng.eircom.net [95.45.153.252])
by mercury.scss.tcd.ie (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 2D74EBE2E;
Sun, 10 Feb 2019 02:34:13 +0000 (GMT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cs.tcd.ie; s=mail;
t=1549766053; bh=NKffxojK+naDutkgiDfoWiHbWq1yDMfK4rB2h5eQF3I=;
h=To:Cc:References:From:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To:From;
b=K6nzyvnKP5Y6+p5/pB2q2qAwoRfFPDPt59plqXTjanzpfMN7IIv7PJjjrm/5RJ7Wr
nfyJZaIYBw08ycEvYFbRlJPaOgbWw1y33y/CzqtfETbkSMpATpGRl3+bWbxys2mHU2
wAGRfOMhJ1snsIrD18UYVYTWO3ijb9Rx7Gyqn8bM=
To: Richard Barnes <rlb@ipv.sx>
Cc: Russ Housley <housley@vigilsec.com>,
draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844-bis@ietf.org, IASA 2 WG <iasa20@ietf.org>,
Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in>
References: <32C06675-C60B-4D6A-979A-FC3653E56D42@cooperw.in>
<23C614C4-5C79-4355-9D74-2ED7D0DE63B2@vigilsec.com>
<CAL02cgTzEQPTXyPL-ermABDne2G8F8UjbPpYADkyxxWHnVVf4g@mail.gmail.com>
<a0a2ef94-335f-5ab6-e49c-7b1c985af3fc@cs.tcd.ie>
<CAL02cgSnxB8-W_m13KM_HsSrE308vv5DuRJzt=t140G9JBdhUw@mail.gmail.com>
From: Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
Openpgp: id=5BB5A6EA5765D2C5863CAE275AB2FAF17B172BEA; url=
Autocrypt: addr=stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata=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Message-ID: <8497f208-ff21-e1bb-7bc1-6f8ec6ee9d8c@cs.tcd.ie>
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 02:34:12 +0000
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/60.4.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <CAL02cgSnxB8-W_m13KM_HsSrE308vv5DuRJzt=t140G9JBdhUw@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512;
protocol="application/pgp-signature";
boundary="zmLfQPxiyJr6YuHtmGurIuc7SHRooFv0x"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/iasa20/puPaUhMED4lwGK55TE1qwIS0v7k>
Subject: Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844-bis-01
X-BeenThere: iasa20@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: =?iso-8859-1?q?Discussions_relating_to_reorganising_the_IETF_administrative_structures_in_the_so_called_=93IASA_2=2E0=94_project=2E?=
<iasa20.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/iasa20>,
<mailto:iasa20-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/iasa20/>
List-Post: <mailto:iasa20@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:iasa20-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/iasa20>,
<mailto:iasa20-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 02:34:23 -0000
Hi Richard, Again, I think you're missing the difference between electricians and an RSE. Continuing to confuse the importance/relevance of those roles doesn't make them any less different. I also think Joel is correct that over-reaching the documentation tweaks being done in this WG would really not be a good plan. On 10/02/2019 00:23, Richard Barnes wrote: > > When the IAB wants to take legal responsibility for the RSE contract, they > can control it. If they don't, then they can't. Disagree. One take-way from the RFCplusplus BoF could be that even if the IAB think they control the RFC series, the community wins when the community tells the IAB they've been inhaling the wrong fumes. So, real control and what you term "legal responsibility" are just not the same things. > That doesn't mean they can't be extensively consulted, but they can't have > ultimate authority over the contract, since they aren't a party. I'd object to any process-RFC update that made this kind of change which I don't believe is in-charter for this WG. I suspect I'd not be alone. (And having said that, I guess I'll now have to read all the drafts, sheesh:-) Cheers, S.
- [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844-bis… Alissa Cooper
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Joseph Lorenzo Hall
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Russ Housley
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Bob Hinden
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Adrian Farrel
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Bob Hinden
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Eliot Lear
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Michael Richardson
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Eliot Lear
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Alissa Cooper
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Leslie Daigle
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Robert Sparks
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Alissa Cooper
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Leslie Daigle
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… John C Klensin
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… John Levine
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Alissa Cooper
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Leslie Daigle
- Re: [Iasa20] Comments on draft-ietf-iasa2-rfc4844… Russ Housley