Re: [Icar] Re: Comments on draft-alvestrand-icar-xarea-00.txt

Brian E Carpenter <brc@zurich.ibm.com> Sun, 02 May 2004 08:31 UTC

Received: from optimus.ietf.org (iesg.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA03938 for <icar-archive@odin.ietf.org>; Sun, 2 May 2004 04:31:20 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1BKCL3-00046K-Bt for icar-archive@odin.ietf.org; Sun, 02 May 2004 04:28:41 -0400
Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i428Sf3H015765 for icar-archive@odin.ietf.org; Sun, 2 May 2004 04:28:41 -0400
Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1BKCIH-000350-Pa for icar-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Sun, 02 May 2004 04:25:49 -0400
Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA03857 for <icar-web-archive@ietf.org>; Sun, 2 May 2004 04:25:47 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org ([132.151.6.1] helo=ietf-mx) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1BKCIE-0002Tp-VX for icar-web-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 02 May 2004 04:25:46 -0400
Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1BKCHN-0002Fu-00 for icar-web-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 02 May 2004 04:24:54 -0400
Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1BKCGR-00021Z-00 for icar-web-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 02 May 2004 04:23:55 -0400
Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1BKCEd-0008PC-EE; Sun, 02 May 2004 04:22:03 -0400
Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1BKCCM-0007TQ-Q8 for icar@optimus.ietf.org; Sun, 02 May 2004 04:19:42 -0400
Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA03684 for <icar@ietf.org>; Sun, 2 May 2004 04:19:40 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org ([132.151.6.1] helo=ietf-mx) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1BKCCJ-000180-Ve for icar@ietf.org; Sun, 02 May 2004 04:19:40 -0400
Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1BKCBN-0000v3-00 for icar@ietf.org; Sun, 02 May 2004 04:18:42 -0400
Received: from mtagate5.de.ibm.com ([195.212.29.154]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1BKCB7-0000i7-00 for icar@ietf.org; Sun, 02 May 2004 04:18:25 -0400
Received: from d12nrmr1507.megacenter.de.ibm.com (d12nrmr1507.megacenter.de.ibm.com [9.149.167.1]) by mtagate5.de.ibm.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i428HmYO135090; Sun, 2 May 2004 08:17:48 GMT
Received: from sihl.zurich.ibm.com (sihl.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.232]) by d12nrmr1507.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VER6.6) with ESMTP id i428HlCE135618; Sun, 2 May 2004 10:17:48 +0200
Received: from zurich.ibm.com (gsine09.us.sine.ibm.com [9.14.6.39]) by sihl.zurich.ibm.com (AIX4.3/8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA62264; Sun, 2 May 2004 10:17:45 +0200
Message-ID: <4094AEB2.4050606@zurich.ibm.com>
Date: Sun, 02 May 2004 10:17:54 +0200
From: Brian E Carpenter <brc@zurich.ibm.com>
Organization: IBM
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113
X-Accept-Language: en, fr, de
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Harald Tveit Alvestrand <harald@alvestrand.no>
CC: icar@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Icar] Re: Comments on draft-alvestrand-icar-xarea-00.txt
References: <697DAA22C5004B4596E033803A7CEF44024DC130@daebe007.americas.noki a.com> <159749067.1083333395@localhost>
In-Reply-To: <159749067.1083333395@localhost>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: icar-admin@ietf.org
Errors-To: icar-admin@ietf.org
X-BeenThere: icar@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12
Precedence: bulk
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/icar>, <mailto:icar-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Id: Improved Cross-Area Review <icar.ietf.org>
List-Post: <mailto:icar@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:icar-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/icar>, <mailto:icar-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org
X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=AWL autolearn=no version=2.60
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Harald Tveit Alvestrand wrote:
> 
> 
> --On 30. april 2004 13:49 -0500 Basavaraj.Patil@nokia.com wrote:
> 
>>
...
>> 2. The I-D is unclear about when the review team is actually involved
>>    in doing the document reviews. It says late review. But just for
>>    clarification does it imply post WG last call or IETF last call?
> 
> 
> I was thinking post IETF Last Call, because Last Call comments should 
> form part of the input to the review team, just as for the IESG today.
> Other models are possible. Good point!

And this is a problem in the split model we seem to be evolving,
with some mid-review done by WG-based teams and this very late review
done by cross-area teams.

IMHO cross-area review should be a continuous process, starting at the
draft-authorname-...-00.txt version and continuing until the
draft-ietf-...-99.txt version. The arguments for that opinion
are in the SIRs draft.

We still need to get rid of late surprises.

    Brian

> 
>>
>> 3. If there is consensus by the review team on a document, the IESG
>>    role is quite limited isnt it? Does the IESG have to review the
>>    document even after review team approval? Or does the IESG simply
>>    review the "review team's" notes? From a process efficiency
>>    perspective at least, there is no reason for the IESG to redo the
>>    work done by the review team.
> 
> 
> As I said in the Korea ICAR meeting, I would like to try to first create 
> the function, then move the formal responsibility. In this case, it's 
> likely (I hope) that IESG review could be limited to "writeup looks 
> reasonable, we believe them".
> 
>                      Harald
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Icar mailing list
> Icar@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/icar
> 

_______________________________________________
Icar mailing list
Icar@ietf.org
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/icar