[Idr] AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-link-bandwidth-15
Ketan Talaulikar <ketant.ietf@gmail.com> Wed, 03 September 2025 17:14 UTC
Return-Path: <ketant.ietf@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: idr@mail2.ietf.org
Delivered-To: idr@mail2.ietf.org
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail2.ietf.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E7575CCE5A3; Wed, 3 Sep 2025 10:14:00 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at ietf.org
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.098
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: mail2.ietf.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail2.ietf.org ([166.84.6.31]) by localhost (mail2.ietf.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BWVzQHyExrq2; Wed, 3 Sep 2025 10:13:59 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pl1-x62e.google.com (mail-pl1-x62e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::62e]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature ECDSA (P-256) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mail2.ietf.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 20C7D5CCE591; Wed, 3 Sep 2025 10:13:59 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pl1-x62e.google.com with SMTP id d9443c01a7336-24c9a399346so1774965ad.0; Wed, 03 Sep 2025 10:13:59 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1756919638; x=1757524438; darn=ietf.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject :date:message-id:reply-to; bh=DHMvo436OeDSkztwXXYTF2+/hKsWqK8sHBNiXWCgnHg=; b=ABYzj/eFXJNKQ+AGuXHuQSDpi/WYMou8nH5ERFILJojTY7FXD6+/i6SUqcCT288osU YePEA//mOG4x0vRwaf9p8vfovi1TGhsdwFOwHUH5jrdu23Qfwz7eOda7v+OFLvTfxpvK nTw5ReVcu4q9l0+Ztlne5jSqY94ITSKWTIZi00oa64KljfnC/qbkC4bf1axgT5cVReSM C6QwjufTXRCjaR2K+LWguz0K/yepA7IK/ipmVKFNG+S4WI/qkrE9ejxNpfhlGdwUI4IF 67owqUF/GTutvwh8Htwtd+S2JYWdmOET6Vwed/g29jIq2RQsHm2lqrS/dc/2S8dRaxLz UwNg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1756919638; x=1757524438; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:mime-version:x-gm-message-state :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=DHMvo436OeDSkztwXXYTF2+/hKsWqK8sHBNiXWCgnHg=; b=Ku6z+r9+aoSUtWB7gApGH7qNMdBKbPj6RhpmzAYQ/wnTgZbzynaaJ4rDt/iYd/pf/3 aVcNCcSt6FF+CxJNqkBwawjgOANGknYyOaupRBXa51HkGIYb9zZUcbEPfB7DNG+rs6Px 7eSsoC5gFIaqdNojisuCrJoBjsGGbbQtLDUA/3us1xirXN1rO7/qAZKVr9iT6XpYOf1Q kQu/EGwC/3f672ReD/3TNeUyBavBqdyfISsgkUipJTIhxCMTedGSsjRXCrsuXjbEiLyR VrW+TQpjDnKOtwhfOQ9hkG04feHmNFF5hh5g/UY4Gbe2zP2/rxdeKubBWmtIwpiohGSc +x+g==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YwC4HTBPfnvzu52zA2HavaDhzR7zvF0r6g1hvZkto/tHtwwfywB RZOhUa8rPU604UzaRcHBz8TTfFKdASs7I1zRLE7TXUcuZrP1HkYidGg0cVCEESUyRTisxIYfYLk GMzaQ9YKlKKoOqJansWmrstKFOJcYBOb8G8/+
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncvxXYPA1gpRvd8iiiew7daNcTxn/C7zQYgNCJmIhT58Pb0V5b80L41U3wZHaPn jP9S5iDNvMQi5WiCnKe6MCx13B2eAffc1PJ0Oz42CzHHlME6uG4Yhd6+EmoenwJp2CAJj9td5sA EspEOt3nBe43VbSq/7VDFOg9QxWfd1Z9x+vH7T2mkapf9u3/4DzfhAQ9+t+6dT2nX/b6H3ErVpP 5yo8CnGTfqcCdmqdd/4ckP3y15slFx1ovsrFd9p
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFcj/+CDXyVLPbTfNxVJJL9YGbPzC3aSlcrpH/zapXwQhSmo3noyP0hbcTlBstvv71akEbbQCGYjEe8Aa1ZQlI=
X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:e80c:b0:24c:bc02:78a1 with SMTP id d9443c01a7336-24cbc0292ebmr3257805ad.2.1756919637416; Wed, 03 Sep 2025 10:13:57 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
From: Ketan Talaulikar <ketant.ietf@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2025 22:43:46 +0530
X-Gm-Features: Ac12FXxfJnAb45AheMRoX3md77REd18txOIXJ-dxqqBEp86m_Ql93K4H6thF30A
Message-ID: <CAH6gdPxO0sOZkho0nUo5YvtM1AhuReixD0b_G8KqTOZ0=Pn=zQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: draft-ietf-idr-link-bandwidth@ietf.org
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000e31f94063de8baef"
Message-ID-Hash: V5GYH6DUOUFMUHRZPP56IHG34SM2WA6V
X-Message-ID-Hash: V5GYH6DUOUFMUHRZPP56IHG34SM2WA6V
X-MailFrom: ketant.ietf@gmail.com
X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-idr.ietf.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header
CC: "idr@ietf. org" <idr@ietf.org>
X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.9rc6
Precedence: list
Subject: [Idr] AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-link-bandwidth-15
List-Id: Inter-Domain Routing <idr.ietf.org>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/idr/5u5Ny1dJ094do3P24WpzhA-pd8s>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/idr>
List-Help: <mailto:idr-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Owner: <mailto:idr-owner@ietf.org>
List-Post: <mailto:idr@ietf.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:idr-join@ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:idr-leave@ietf.org>
Hello Authors (and WG), Thanks for your work on picking up this long pending document and the collaborations in getting it across the WG finish line. Please find below my AD evaluation review with comments and suggestions inline in the idnits output of v15 of the document. Please look for the tag < EoRv15 > at the bottom of the email. If you don't find that, likely the email has been truncated by your email client and you should refer to the IDR mailing list archive for the full review email. The review has been done with a "fresh eyes" view of the current document towards RFC publication and the suggestions are to improve the readability. Thanks, Ketan < general/major > I would like to strongly recommend to the authors and the WG to include some text that explains what is meant by "link" in this document. Ideally, the EC could have been just called Bandwidth Extended Community" or even "Path Bandwidth Extended Community" where the "path" can be described in BGP terms (i.e., towards a BGP nexthop). However, I realize that it may be too late for such a change and so, just clarifying what "link" means will be sufficient (something like - The term link in this document ...). < related editorial > Please look for "link bandwidth" (in other than the name of the community) and see if it can be simply replaced by "bandwidth" without affecting the meaning of the text. In some other places, it probably needs to be replaced with the community name. 19 Abstract 21 This document describes an application of BGP extended communities 22 that allows a router to perform WECMP (Weighted Equal-Cost 23 Multipath). <major> The document is actually specifying a new BGP extended community. SUGGEST: This document specifies a BGP Extended Community that enables routers to perform weighted equal-cost multipath (WECMP). 89 network performance. Traditional equal-cost multi-path (ECMP) 90 routing does not account for the varying capacities of different 91 paths. This document suggests that the external link bandwidth be <minor> Can you please clarify the meaning of "external link" here? Is it not OK to just delete the word "external" ? 93 [RFC4360] - the transitive and non-transitive Link Bandwidth Extended 94 Community. The Link Bandwidth Extended Community provides a <minor> Please consider abbreviating Link Bandwidth Extended Community for ease of reading and then it can be used consistently through the rest of the document. 95 mechanism for routers to advertise the bandwidth of their downstream 96 path(s), facilitating maximum utilization of network resources. < minor > perhaps s/maximum/optimal ? 98 2. Link Bandwidth Extended Community 100 The Link Bandwidth Extended Community is defined as a BGP extended 101 community that carries the bandwidth information of a router, 102 represented by BGP Protocol Next Hop, connecting to remote network. < major > What is the difference between 'BGP Protocol Next Hop' and 'BGP Next Hop'? Is the former term defined in an RFC? 103 This community can be used to inform other routers about the 104 available bandwidth through a given route. < minor > given route or given router? 113 any 2-byte value. If the Autonomous System number cannot be 114 represented in two octets, as enabled by [RFC6793], AS_TRANS should 115 be used in the Global Administrator subfield. The encoding of <minor> To improve readability SUGGEST: If the Autonomous System number cannot be represented in two octets, AS_TRANS [RFC6793] SHOULD be used in the Global Administrator subfield. 144 3. Protocol Procedures <major> Please consider adding the suggested text here at the beginning to avoid repetition in the procedures in this section. The key point is that the document is trying to safeguard existing deployments that use different implementations that use different transitivity types. This is more about those deployments. SUGGEST (new text to insert): The procedures cover both the transitive and non-transitive variants of the Link Bandwidth Extended Community and for implementations to handle both variants in a way that supports existing deployments. Please refer to sections 5 and 8 for more details. 146 3.1. Sender (Originating Link Bandwidth Extended Community) < major >The term "originate" can be confusing. Is the the router that originally introduced the LBW when it originated the route, or is it simply the router that includes LBW with the route that it advertises? Does replacing "originate" with "advertise" (or something like that) work? Similarly, does replacing "originator" with "sender" work? In other words are the procedures here only for the "originator" and not any "sender"? What complicates things is there is also a separate section 3.3 about re-advertisement. Can the contents of section 3.3 be moved into section 3.1 where it just becomes about "sender" and the subtleties about NHS/NHU can also be described herein? 148 An originator of Link Bandwidth Extended Community SHOULD be able to 149 originate either a transitive or a non-transitive Link Bandwidth 150 Extended Community. Implementations SHOULD provide configuration to <minor> To improve readability SUGGEST: A router advertising Link Bandwidth Extended Community SHOULD be able to send either a transitive or a non-transitive or both types of Link Bandwidth Extended Community. 151 set the transitivity type of the Link Bandwidth Extended Community, 152 as well as the Global Administrator and bandwidth values in (Local 153 Administrator field), using local policy. For backward 154 compatibility, different implementations MAY use different default 155 values for the transitivity type of the Link Bandwidth Extended <minor> How about all the backward compatibility and the operations related to the two types be focused in section 8 to make it easier for the reader? SUGGEST-1: Different implementations MAY use different default values for the transitivity type of the Link Bandwidth Extended Community. OR (if you are not adding the text at the start of section 3, then) SUGGEST-2: Different implementations MAY use different default values for the transitivity type of the Link Bandwidth Extended Community (see section 8 for details). 156 Community. The provided configuration SHOULD allow operators to 157 override the default transitivity value as needed. An implementation 158 MAY advertise a link bandwidth value as zero. < major > Can the last sentence be moved from this section to Error Handling as follows? It is a bit stronger even if the end result is the same. SUGGEST (for error handling section): The link bandwidth value of 0 MUST NOT be considered as malformed. 160 No more than one Link Bandwidth Extended Community SHOULD be attached 161 to a route. For purpose of backward compatibility during transition, <major> What happens if two LBW of the same type get attached? This is already covered in the error handling. So, perhaps the intent of this text is better captured as: CURRENT: No more than one Link Bandwidth Extended Community SHOULD be attached to a route. For purpose of backward compatibility during transition, a BGP speaker MAY attach one Link Bandwidth Extended Community per transitivity (transitive/non-transitive) both having the same 'Link Bandwidth Value' field. SUGGEST: Generally, a single Link Bandwidth Extended Community of the transitivity type that is desired in a deployment is attached to a route. However during transition (refer section 8 for details), a BGP speaker MAY attach one Link Bandwidth Extended Community per transitivity (transitive/non-transitive) both having the same 'Link Bandwidth Value' field. 172 Note: Implementations MAY provide a configuration option to send non- 173 transitive Link Bandwidth Extended Communities on external BGP 174 sessions. < major > Please remove the "Note:" since this is text with normative language and not a "note". There is a similar instance in section 3.2 as well. 188 Implementations MUST be able to process and accept a Link Bandwidth 189 Extended Community where the bandwidth value is set to zero. WECMP 190 can be utilized when all contributing paths have a non-zero value in 191 the Link Bandwidth Extended Community. 193 In case some paths have a zero value but others have non-zero value, 194 or all paths have Link Bandwidth with zero value, the behavior is 195 determined by local policy. For example, an implementation may 196 exclude the paths with zero value from WECMP formation or an 197 implementation may fallback to ECMP. < minor > Please see this suggestion in conjunction with the comment in section 3.1 CURRENT: Implementations MUST be able to process and accept a Link Bandwidth Extended Community where the bandwidth value is set to zero. WECMP can be utilized when all contributing paths have a non-zero value in the Link Bandwidth Extended Community. In case some paths have a zero value but others have non-zero value, or all paths have Link Bandwidth with zero value, the behavior is determined by local policy. For example, an implementation may exclude the paths with zero value from WECMP formation or an implementation may fallback to ECMP. SUGGEST: Zero is a valid bandwidth value to be set in the Link Bandwidth Extended Community. WECMP can be utilized when all contributing paths have a non-zero value in the Link Bandwidth Extended Community. However, in the case where the paths have a mix of zero and non-zero values, or all zero values, the behavior is determined by local policy. For example, implementations MAY exclude the paths with zero value from WECMP formation as long as at least one path with non-zero value exists or they MAY fallback to ECMP. 207 In the absence of any import or export policies that alter the Link 208 Bandwidth Extended Community, any received Link Bandwidth Extended 209 Community on the route will be re-advertised unchanged, in accordance 210 with standard BGP procedures. < major > Should the text not just say "route policies" as opposed to being explicit about import/export? Furthermore there should be a pointer to section 3.4 as well? SUGGEST: In the absence of any route policies that alter the Link Bandwidth Extended Community, any received Link Bandwidth Extended Community on the route will be re-advertised unchanged. Please also refer to section 3.4 for use in a BGP multipath environment. 212 3.3.2. Re-advertisement with Next Hop Unchanged 214 A BGP speaker that receives a route with a Link Bandwidth Extended 215 Community, re-advertises or reflects the same without changing its 216 next hop, SHOULD NOT change the Link Bandwidth Extended Community in 217 any way. < minor > For better readability SUGGEST: A BGP speaker that receives a route with a Link Bandwidth Extended Community and re-advertises or reflects the same without changing its next hop, SHOULD NOT change the Link Bandwidth Extended Community in any way. 219 3.4. Link Bandwidth Extended Community Arithmetic and BGP Multipath 221 In a BGP multipath ECMP environment, the link bandwidth value that is 222 sent or re-advertised may be calculated based on the Link Bandwidth 223 Extended Community of the routes contributing to multipath in the 224 Local Routing Information Base (Local-RIB). This topic is beyond the 225 scope of this document. < major > This text does not cover the cumulative LBW scenario which is one of the key use-cases. Should this text at least not allude to the cumulative LBW usage (ideally with an informative reference to the use-case document currently in BESS WG) even if the details are outside the scope of this document? Another thing to look at it is that the abstract talks about "weighted" ECMP but there is no description of even how those weights are determined. So, we need some more text to cover that aspect as well. 246 Link Bandwidth Extended Communities with a negative value SHALL be 247 ignored and MUST NOT be originated. < major > s/MUST NOT be orignated./MUST NOT be advertised. 252 5. Document History < major > While this section is very valuable, I don't think it belongs in the body of the document when it becomes an RFC. Please move it into the Appendix section. 254 BGP Link Bandwidth Extended Community has evolved over several 255 versions of the IETF draft. In the earlier versions up to draft- 256 ietf-idr-link-bandwidth-08, only the non-transitive version of Link 257 Bandwidth Extended Community was supported. However, starting from 258 draft-ietf-idr-link-bandwidth-09, both transitive and non-transitive 259 versions of Link Bandwidth Extended Community are supported. 261 An old sender/receiver is a BGP speaker that uses procedures up to 262 draft (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-idr-link- 263 bandwidth-08) or any undocumented behavior for Link Bandwidth 264 Extended Community. 266 A new sender/receiver is a BGP speaker that implements procedures 267 specified in this document. <major> The term "older" is used only in section 8.1 and there it can be simply replaced by "an implementation that understands only one transitivity type". There is no use of "newer". So, while the first and the last (fourth) paragraph of this section is important, the second and third don't seem necessary to me. 269 A BGP speaker (Sender or Receiver) needs to be upgraded to support 270 the procedures defined in this document to provide full 271 interoperability for both transitive and non-transitive versions of 272 Link Bandwidth Extended Community. In order to simplify 273 implementations, it is not a goal to provide interoperability by 274 upgrading only the RR. 276 6. IANA Considerations 278 This document defines a specific application of the two-octet AS 279 specific extended community. <major> The above sentence does not belong to the IANA consideration section and should be removed. 293 Name 294 ---- 295 non-transitive Link Bandwidth Extended Community 297 Both updates are to Reference this document. <nit> s/Reference/reference 299 7. Security Considerations 301 There are no additional security risks introduced by this design. <major> I think this section needs to discuss the aspect that the LBW conveys the bandwidth available (e.g., in the cumulative use case) and this information going out say over the Internet can result in disclosure of bandwidth and capacity that is private to a network. Doesn't there need to be a discussion about the use of LBW being within single provider network or between trusted parties - i.e., not over the Internet - with a short mention of filtering of this community? 314 In circumstances where networks have deployed a mixture of 315 implementations supporting this document's current procedures for < nit > s/current procedure/procedure 318 A primary example is when a route received by a BGP speaker contains < nit > s/primary/prime ? 322 community may be have an inconsistent value. As a result, downstream 323 BGP speakers that may receive such routes may perform inappropriate 324 ECMP load balancing. <minor> s/may be have/may have .... and also ... s/ECMP/WECMP 328 take actions to address such inconsistencies. One example would be <minor> s/example/option ? 336 Ideally this operational consideration is short-lived until the 337 network has been upgraded to implementations that consistently 338 support the procedures in this draft. <minor> To better capture the intent? SUGGEST: Ideally this operational consideration is short-lived until the routers in the network have been upgraded to (versions of) implementations that support the procedures in this document. < EoRv15 >
- [Idr] AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-link… Ketan Talaulikar
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Ketan Talaulikar
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Anoop Ghanwani
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Jeffrey Haas
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Reshma Das
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Ketan Talaulikar
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Jeffrey Haas
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Ketan Talaulikar
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Jeffrey Haas
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Ketan Talaulikar
- [Idr] Re: AD evaluation review of draft-ietf-idr-… Robert Raszuk