Re: [Idr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-kumari-deprecate-as-set-confed-set-00.txt

[Robert Raszuk <[e-mail]>]

Hi Brian and Sriram,

Simple question ...

Some BGP implementations use AS_SET when IBGP multipath is enabled to 
correctly advertise what is being used in data plane to a peer.

What authors of the document in question recommend to do in this case ?

And also as Enke said no matter what draft or rfc says deployed code 
will remain.

In those cases AS_SET will continue to be advertised injected by those 
BGP implementations as there is no even CLI control to stop it.

The multipath code simply calls the aspath_aggregate (latest quagga code 
http://goo.gl/ISBWj line 669) which in turn IMHO correctly inserts the 
AS_SET (http://goo.gl/oSsxE line 996).

Thx,
R.


> The "analysis" (slide deck) does not itself detail the few cases where
> AS_SET is not used incorrectly.
>
> Since one of the authors was involved in that analysis, for sake of
> discussing this proposal, could you please provide the following?
>
> - route-views data on AS_SET announcements that are properly formed (per
> your analysis)
> - route-views data on related announcements (e.g. exact-match or
> longer-prefix that form the basis for the AS_SET aggregates)
>
> This would be the actual data, not just "counts" of the number of prefixes.
> Knowing who is doing this, which prefixes are affected, and such, will
> help inform us on the usage of AS_SET "in the wild".
>
> Also, along with those prefixes, could you search the route-views data
> to find out when the first announcement for each (even roughly, YYYY-MM
> is good enough) occurred, with the current values?
>
> If something has been announced in exactly the same form, for a very
> long time, perhaps the configuration is just being "left alone" because
> none of the techies at the organization understand what it is, what it
> does, or why it is there?
>
> And maybe someone could do out-reach to those entities to show them why
> & how what they are doing is not necessary, and how to achieve whatever
> the original goals were, without using AS_SET?
>
> (If we can reduce the well-formed instances "in the wild" to as close to
> zero as possible, I think it would be safe to then treat the malformed
> AS_SET instances as outliers, regardless of quantity.)
>
> It is a lot easier to deprecate something that isn't being used
> correctly at all, than something that is *almost* not being used
> correctly at all.
>
> And even if the latter, I am in favor of adoption of this as a WG item.
>
> I'm just suggesting the above to move away from the "angels dancing on
> the head of a pin" kind of discussion.
>
> Brian
>
> On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 12:21 PM, Sriram, Kotikalapudi
> <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
>
>     Recall that RFC6472/BCP172 is a *recommendation* for not using
>     AS_SET and AS_CONFED_SET in BGP.
>     It was intended that eventually there would be a document to *proscribe*
>     the use of the AS_SET and AS_CONFED_SET types of the AS_PATH in BGP.
>     So this document (
>     http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-kumari-deprecate-as-set-confed-set-00 )
>     is being submitted for consideration by the WG to start work on a
>     standards-track RFC
>     for deprecation of AS_SET and AS_CONFED _SET in BGPv4.
>     Any comments and suggestions would be welcome and much appreciated.
>
>     Sriram / Warren
>
>     -----Original Message-----
>     From: [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
>     [mailto:[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>]
>     Sent: Friday, July 06, 2012 7:40 PM
>     To: [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
>     Cc: [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>; Sriram, Kotikalapudi
>     Subject: New Version Notification for
>     draft-kumari-deprecate-as-set-confed-set-00.txt
>
>     A new version of I-D, draft-kumari-deprecate-as-set-confed-set-00.txt
>     has been successfully submitted by Kotikalapudi Sriram and posted to
>     the IETF repository.
>
>     Filename:        draft-kumari-deprecate-as-set-confed-set
>     Revision:        00
>     Title:           Deprecation of AS_SET and AS_CONFED_SET in BGP
>     Creation date:   2012-07-07
>     WG ID:           Individual Submission
>     Number of pages: 6
>     URL:
>     http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumari-deprecate-as-set-confed-set-00.txt
>     Status:
>     http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-kumari-deprecate-as-set-confed-set
>     Htmlized:
>     http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-kumari-deprecate-as-set-confed-set-00
>
>     Abstract:
>         RFC 6472 (i.e., BCP 172) recommends not using AS_SET and
>         AS_CONFED_SET in BGP.  This document updates RFC 4271 and proscribes
>         the use of the AS_SET and AS_CONFED_SET types of the AS_PATH in
>         BGPv4.  This is done to simplify the design and implementation
>     of BGP
>         and to make the semantics of the originator of a route more clear.
>         This will also simplify the design, implementation, and
>     deployment of
>         ongoing work in the Secure Inter-Domain Routing Working Group.
>
>     The IETF Secretariat
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