[Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capability-00.txt
Donatas Abraitis <donatas.abraitis@gmail.com> Wed, 23 October 2024 11:30 UTC
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From: Donatas Abraitis <donatas.abraitis@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2024 14:29:45 +0300
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To: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
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CC: "Krishnaswamy Ananthamurthy (kriswamy)" <kriswamy=40cisco.com@dmarc.ietf.org>, "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>
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Subject: [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capability-00.txt
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But then... Without dynamically sending (dynamic capability or another type of message?) this capability it's _hard_ to imagine how it would work correctly. Clearly, as Robert said, the operational section is a MUST here. On Wed, Oct 23, 2024 at 2:23 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote: > It is not as sweet as it looks :) > > List of route types keeps getting extended in multi route-type AFI/SAFIs > .. so you really never know what is supported by the peer unless you know > how to operate your network well. > > I think the proposal is a safety fuse to address not so well operated > networks ... > > Cheers, > R. > > On Wed, Oct 23, 2024 at 12:21 PM Donatas Abraitis < > donatas.abraitis@gmail.com> wrote: > >> What optional route types would be advertised? I mean if an >> implementation supports let's say EVPN, LS, etc. does it >> include all of them or the _list_ should be configurable? >> >> On Tue, Oct 22, 2024 at 10:12 PM Krishnaswamy Ananthamurthy (kriswamy) >> <kriswamy=40cisco.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote: >> >>> Hi Robert, >>> >>> Appreciate your quick review and feedback, and the following is the >>> response. >>> >>> >>> >>> #1 – Will update the text >>> >>> #2 – Will expand the operation section and will consider your suggestion >>> >>> #3 – Will discuss with co-authors and respond accordingly. >>> >>> >>> >>> Thanks >>> >>> Krishna >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> *From: *Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> >>> *Date: *Tuesday, October 22, 2024 at 1:59 PM >>> *To: *Krishnaswamy Ananthamurthy (kriswamy) <kriswamy@cisco.com> >>> *Cc: *idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.org> >>> *Subject: *Re: [Idr] FW: New Version Notification for >>> draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capability-00.txt >>> >>> All, >>> >>> >>> >>> Actually I have a 3rd comment which appeared after I hit the send >>> button. >>> >>> >>> >>> Since you are really doing route type filtering here it seems to me that >>> a much better suited mechanism for this would be an ORF message. >>> >>> >>> >>> In fact it is also much more flexible - you can freely use it during BGP >>> sessions being already established without need for session reset to enable >>> reception of new service/new NLRI types. >>> >>> >>> >>> A simple extension would be like Dynamic Route-Types support with most >>> of the existing cfg/cli/show commands or logging already in place. >>> >>> >>> >>> Think about it .... >>> >>> >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Robert >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Oct 22, 2024 at 6:08 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> >>> >>> I have two comments on this draft. >>> >>> >>> >>> #1 >>> >>> >>> >>> Draft says: >>> >>> >>> >>> > This document defines an optional capability exchange of route types >>> >>> > per AFI/SAFI such that BGP speakers *negotiate* the route types >>> >>> >>> >>> Unfortunately BGP capabilities do not negotiate anything in BGP. Please >>> search on number of discussions on this point on the list in the past. >>> >>> >>> >>> So I recommend you change this into: >>> >>> >>> >>> This document defines an optional capability exchange of route types per >>> AFI/SAFI such that BGP speakers *signal* the route types >>> >>> >>> >>> #2 >>> >>> >>> >>> Operational consideration is missing ... >>> >>> >>> >>> The scenario where this draft could play a role is that operator enables >>> mix of services between two nodes. >>> >>> >>> >>> Now this mix of services is not symmetrical. >>> >>> >>> >>> Today session does not come up and it is clear there is configuration >>> mistake which needs to be corrected. >>> >>> >>> >>> With this draft session will happily come up and only "supported" >>> services by a peer as expressed in supported route types for a given >>> AFI/SAFI peer will be sent. >>> >>> >>> >>> How is this helping operator to consistently run the services ? If he >>> would not count on exchanging those with the peer it would not be >>> configured in the first place. >>> >>> >>> >>> Bigger question how would a router signal that only partial of >>> configured services operate within say EVPN AF ? >>> >>> >>> >>> It seems that it would lead to really weak configuration habits in a >>> style - enable all and see what get's exchanged. >>> >>> >>> >>> In other words having ability to know what services/route types my peers >>> support for a given AFI/SAFI seems cool. But only informationally. >>> >>> >>> >>> Using this information for automated service propagation >>> suppression/filtering is IMHO much less cool .. if at all a good thing. >>> >>> >>> >>> Kind regards, >>> >>> Robert >>> >>> >>> >>> PS. And it may be interesting to see a section on how this may help to >>> enable new route types dynamically on the existing running nodes and within >>> existing established BGP sessions with many AFI/SAFIs. Of course assumption >>> is that running operating systems on those nodes does support it already - >>> but new services where not enable at boot time (BGP sessions establishment >>> time). >>> >>> >>> >>> Where am I going with this PS note ... >>> >>> >>> >>> As we are really touching a new territory of signalling embedded route >>> types (different NLRI formats) within single AFI/SAFI(s) perhaps this is >>> good time to rethink it and write up Dynamic Route-Types proposal which >>> could be signalled between nodes not really using BGP Capabilities >>> semantics. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Oct 22, 2024 at 12:58 AM Krishnaswamy Ananthamurthy (kriswamy) >>> <kriswamy=40cisco.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote: >>> >>> IDR WG, >>> >>> We have posted a new draft outlining route type capability to address >>> BGP session reset whenever new route type is added to address families like >>> EVPN. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capability >>> >>> Request the WG to review and provide feedback/comments. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Krishna >>> >>> >>> >>> *From: *internet-drafts@ietf.org <internet-drafts@ietf.org> >>> *Date: *Monday, October 21, 2024 at 5:51 PM >>> *To: *Keyur Patel <keyur@arrcus.com>, Krishnaswamy Ananthamurthy >>> (kriswamy) <kriswamy@cisco.com>, Lukas Krattiger (lkrattig) < >>> lkrattig@cisco.com>, Mankamana Mishra (mankamis) <mankamis@cisco.com> >>> *Subject: *New Version Notification for >>> draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capability-00.txt >>> >>> A new version of Internet-Draft >>> draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capability-00.txt has been successfully >>> submitted by Krishnaswamy Ananthamurthy and posted to the >>> IETF repository. >>> >>> Name: draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capability >>> Revision: 00 >>> Title: BGP Route Type Capability >>> Date: 2024-10-21 >>> Group: Individual Submission >>> Pages: 5 >>> URL: >>> https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capability-00.txt >>> Status: >>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capability/ >>> HTMLized: >>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capability >>> >>> >>> Abstract: >>> >>> BGP supports different route types, which defines the encoding of >>> Network Layer Reachability Information (NLRI) for a some of the >>> Address Family Identifier (AFI)/Subsequent Address Family Identifier >>> (SAFI) like Ethernet VPN (EVPN), Multicast VPN(MVPN) and so on. BGP >>> speaker will reset the BGP session if a given route type is not >>> supported. This document defines an Optional Capabilities to >>> exchange the route types supported for a given AFI/SAFI such that >>> session are not reset. >>> >>> >>> >>> The IETF Secretariat >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Idr mailing list -- idr@ietf.org >>> To unsubscribe send an email to idr-leave@ietf.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Idr mailing list -- idr@ietf.org >>> To unsubscribe send an email to idr-leave@ietf.org >>> >> >> >> -- >> Donatas >> > -- Donatas
- [Idr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-kris… Krishnaswamy Ananthamurthy (kriswamy)
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Krishnaswamy Ananthamurthy (kriswamy)
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Donatas Abraitis
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Donatas Abraitis
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Donatas Abraitis
- [Idr] draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capability-00 Jorge Rabadan (Nokia)
- [Idr] Re: draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capabilit… Krishnaswamy Ananthamurthy (kriswamy)
- [Idr] Re: draft-kriswamy-idr-route-type-capabilit… Jorge Rabadan (Nokia)
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Krishnaswamy Ananthamurthy (kriswamy)
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Krishnaswamy Ananthamurthy (kriswamy)
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Donatas Abraitis
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Ketan Talaulikar
- [Idr] Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: New Version Notification for draft-kris… Jeffrey Haas
- [Idr] Re: New Version Notification for draft-kris… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: New Version Notification for draft-kris… Jeffrey Haas
- [Idr] Re: New Version Notification for draft-kris… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: New Version Notification for draft-kris… Jeffrey Haas
- [Idr] Re: New Version Notification for draft-kris… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: New Version Notification for draft-kris… Jeffrey Haas
- [Idr] Re: New Version Notification for draft-kris… Robert Raszuk
- [Idr] Re: New Version Notification for draft-kris… Jeffrey Haas
- [Idr] Re: New Version Notification for draft-kris… Robert Raszuk