Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acceptown-community-01.txt
"UTTARO, JAMES, ATTLABS" <uttaro@att.com> Mon, 05 May 2008 16:18 UTC
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Thread-Topic: Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acceptown-community-01.txt
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From: "UTTARO, JAMES, ATTLABS" <uttaro@att.com>
To: idr@ietf.org
Cc: "NGUYEN, HAN Q, ATTLABS" <hnguyen@att.com>, "LONGHITANO, ANTHONY C, ATTLABS" <aclonghitano@att.com>, "RAMSAROOP, JEEWAN P, ATTLABS" <jramsaroop@att.com>
Subject: Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acceptown-community-01.txt
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I wanted to take an opportunity to discuss the rationale for this draft. We have seen an explosion in the growth of our VPN services both domestically and globally. Many customers span multiple IGP and BGP domains with sites in both the AP, EMEA, etc... There are multiple BGP domains with the number of edge devices supporting RFC 2547 numbered in the thousands. As a SP we have seen these customers demanding more and more sophisticated routing services/solutions. These range from providing routing granularity at a regional/global/PE level, providing SP value added content and VPN Stitching. As we have thousands of customers and millions of routes there is a tremendous opportunity to stitch VPNs. These opportunities services include stitching SP value added services into customer VPNs, providing middleman services to stitch routing between multiple VPNs ( GM , Ford, etc... ) and TOD services within the context of a single VPN or between VPNs. The biggest challenge is how to operationalize these services in a way that is simple, efficient and easily modified. The current state of the art is to either modify import/export lists on each VRF A and VRF B on each PE to leak routes. Of course on a PE with VRF A and VRF B we need to apply different configuration to leak routes locally. The major disadvantages to this approach are: a) Operational Complexity For a simple gross extranet multiple PEs need to be touched with configuration applied to each VPNs routing context to create a complete stitch. Assume two multi-national multi-national corporations that span US, EMEA and AP with VPN instantiated on 300-400 PEs that want to share routing state. Our systems need to re-configure all of these PEs to modify the import/export lists. Of course we have a multiple vendors where each vendor has different platforms with different code bases. This makes for a laborious set of requirements on our software development staff. If we want to create a more complex extranet these same issues are magnified. Each additional VPN stitched requires additional configuration on the n-1 VPNs currently participating in the extranet as each VPNs routing context now needs to import the additional RT representing the newly stitched VPN. b) Dynamic/Temporal Stitching One variation of VPN stitching is where customers want to stitch for some period of time. The example that immediately comes to mind is "Follow the SUN" although this is by no means the only one. In this case customers may want to stitch VPNs together for some period of time that is configurable and agreed to by all parties. This would require that a SP would need to reconfigure PEs quite often assuming the current state of the art. This creates a lot of configuration churn that can lead to customer routing instability as VRF are re-built with the new RTs. c) Route Granularity In the above two examples the simple modification of the import/export list would create a situation where all of the routes within in each VPN would be leaked to the other. This is not only undesirable but unacceptable. Customers do not want to simply create a merged VPN where all of the routing information is made available to the other VPN. They want to selectively leak a set of prefixes between them. This is the same for two or more customer VPNs as well as SP value added stitching. This level of granularity would require an entirely different set of software tools which identify prefixes on a per VPN/PE level and then apply the appropriate RT information. Why is this draft so powerful? With this draft the SP can simply manage routing information from central location. In order to create a VPN stitch, the SP simply applies RTs to facilitate the stitch and reflects to all PEs. In order to deliver these services from a central location ( RR, etc... ) we need to be able to reflect a route back to the PE that originated it. This is due to the fact the the two VPNs being stitched may reside on the same PE. Assuming a central distribution paradigm we need to have this Accept-Own capability. Without it we will need to either capacity manage the PEs so that two VPNs that will be stitched now or in the future are not on the same PE. We can never now apriori so that means we would need to migrate entire VPN routing contexts with associated multiple interfaces from one PE to another which would create customer outages. This is simply not acceptable. Thanks, Jim Uttaro
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- [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acceptow… Danny McPherson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Ilya Varlashkin
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Ilya Varlashkin
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Danny McPherson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Danny McPherson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Enke Chen
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Danny McPherson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Enke Chen
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Danny McPherson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Enke Chen
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Danny McPherson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Danny McPherson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Fwd:I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… Robert Raszuk
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Danny McPherson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd:I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… Danny McPherson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd:I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Fwd:I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… Brian Dickson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd:I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… Robert Raszuk
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… UTTARO, JAMES, ATTLABS
- Re: [Idr] Fwd:I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… Danny McPherson
- [Idr] Route reflectors [was: Re: Fwd:I-D ACTION:d… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Route reflectors [was: Re: Fwd:I-D ACTI… Brian Dickson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-DACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… Ilya Varlashkin
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-DACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… UTTARO, JAMES, ATTLABS
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-DACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… Danny McPherson
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-DACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… Jim Guichard (jguichar)
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-DACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… Ilya Varlashkin
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-DACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Jim Guichard (jguichar)
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… UTTARO, JAMES, ATTLABS
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… John G. Scudder
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-acce… David Ward
- Re: [Idr] Fwd: I-DACTION:draft-pmohapat-idr-accep… Pradosh Mohapatra (pmohapat)
- [Idr] draft-pmohapat-softwire-lb-00.txt Pradosh Mohapatra (pmohapat)