[Idr] BGP MIBv2 discontinuity objects
Jeffrey Haas <jhaas@pfrc.org> Mon, 07 July 2008 03:24 UTC
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Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 23:24:51 -0400
From: Jeffrey Haas <jhaas@pfrc.org>
To: Joan Cucchiara <jcucchiara@mindspring.com>
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References: <06f701c88b5b$22622000$6601a8c0@JoanPC> <20080503223750.GG23560@scc.mi.org> <00f801c8b542$2d1a0c90$6601a8c0@JoanPC> <20080611022929.GA633@slice> <012201c8de39$63ca17b0$6601a8c0@JoanPC>
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Cc: "Dan Romascanu (E-mail)" <dromasca@avaya.com>, David Ward <dward@cisco.com>, "MIB Doctors (E-mail)" <mib-doctors@ietf.org>, idr@ietf.org
Subject: [Idr] BGP MIBv2 discontinuity objects
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On Fri, Jul 04, 2008 at 08:52:24PM -0400, Joan Cucchiara wrote: > DISCONTINUITY DISCUSSION: > >> -- >> -- Discontinuity >> -- >> bgpDiscontinuityTime OBJECT-TYPE >> SYNTAX TimeStamp >> MAX-ACCESS read-only >> STATUS current >> DESCRIPTION >> "The value of sysUpTime at the most recent occasion at which >> this BGP management instance has suffered a discontinuity. >> >> In particular, tables with abstract indexes such as >> bgpAfPathAttrIndex, bgpAsPathIndex and >> bgpAfPathAttrUnknownIndex are not guaranteed to contain the >> same data across discontinuities." >> ::= { bgp 13 } >> > > > If the value of the indices change > and can be different from the objects, then what is the point of > having the objects? I'm not sure I understand your question. Fundamentally, the problem is the inability of SMIv2 to represent complex structured information. If SMI had retained ASN.1's ability to have stacked data structures, all of this information would be present in a single, albeit verbose, table. This verbosity is notable since BGP implementations usually implement mechanisms to factor and re-use data that is present more than once. For example, while multiple route sets may all have the same identical set of BGP Communities, it is typically stored once and reference counted. Since we are limited to using SMI, the result is that an abstract index must be used to glue the tables one to another. This also allows a given table row to have a many to one relationship to shared data. E.g. BgpNlriEntry's bgpAfPathAttrIndex. > I would like to break this down into a specific discussion > prior to agreeing on one Discontinuity Object (or more than one). > > discontinuity scenarios in BGP4 Protocol: > > * SNMP agent restarts (sysUpTime is affected) which is default behavior > * bgp entity restarts (what you are calling the BGP Management instance?) > (assume this is separate from SNMP agent) It is possible that a BGP instance will share the fate of its SNMP agent and vice versa but this varies wildly by implementation. > * peer restarts/lost connection > * specific session goes from established state to some other state [These are fundamentally the same.] While this is a discontinuity of sorts, the behavior of this is well defined by the BGP specifications. The base behavior is defined by the FSM in RFC 4271 and potentially altered by Graceful Restart, RFC 4274. > The following (I think?) would be affected by SNMP Agent Restarts, bgp > Entity > Restarts, peer restarts, and FSM establish state transition. Is this > correct? > > > bgpPeerAfInUpdates > bgpPeerAfOutUpdates > bgpPeerAfInTotalMessages > bgpPeerAfOutTotalMessages These are affected by SNMP agent restarts and potentially by BGP Instance restarts. It is typical for the SNMP agent to fetch these values from the BGP instance. While it is possible for the BGP instance upon restart to maintain their values, this is completely an implementation detail and may not happen. > bgpPeerAfFsmEstablishedTransitions This may be affected by the SNMP agent restarting, the BGP instance restarting and is altered as a result of BGP peer transitions/restarts. > [So more of a question for the WG, > Are the bgpPeerAfInTotalMessages and bgpPeerAfOutTotalMessages > counters useful? ] Not speaking for the whole of the working group but some operators use these values as a metric of BGP "chatter". This is helpful in pinpointing specific BGP instances and peering sessions that are "close to" route flapping. > [As an aside, the bgpPrefixCountersTable should be renamed to > remove the word counter since these are actually Gauge32.] I have renamed these to be bgpPrefixGauges* > bgpAfPathAttrCounter - Typically, these values are not > included in MIBs and are calculated by the NMS. However, if > this needs to be in the MIB, then > think that it probably should be a Gauge32, rather than a > Counter32. I have made this a Gauge32 and renamed it to bgpAfPathAttrGauge. Feedback over the years on the MIB had stressed on the ability to monitor the general size of the routing table. The prefix gauges provide one level of monitoring this while the Path Attribute gauge provides another. These tables are typically *VERY LARGE* and a full walk simply to generate this count (which is often available from the management instance as a scalar courtesy of the BGP instance) puts undue load on the BGP Instance. -- Jeff _______________________________________________ Idr mailing list Idr@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/idr
- [Idr] Early MIB Dr. Review of draft-ietf-idr-bgp4… Joan Cucchiara
- Re: [Idr] Early MIB Dr. Review of draft-ietf-idr-… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] Early MIB Dr. Review of draft-ietf-idr-… Joan Cucchiara
- Re: [Idr] Early MIB Dr. Review of draft-ietf-idr-… tom.petch
- Re: [Idr] Early MIB Dr. Review of draft-ietf-idr-… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] Early MIB Dr. Review of draft-ietf-idr-… tom.petch
- Re: [Idr] Early MIB Dr. Review of draft-ietf-idr-… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] Early MIB Dr. Review of draft-ietf-idr-… Joan Cucchiara
- [Idr] RFC 1657 MIB errors/corrections Jeffrey Haas
- [Idr] Factoring the bgpPeerAfTable in BGP MIBv2 Jeffrey Haas
- [Idr] BGP MIBv2 discontinuity objects Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] BGP MIBv2 discontinuity objects Joan Cucchiara
- Re: [Idr] BGP MIBv2 discontinuity objects Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] BGP MIBv2 discontinuity objects Joan Cucchiara
- Re: [Idr] [MIB-DOCTORS] BGP MIBv2 discontinuity o… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] [MIB-DOCTORS] BGP MIBv2 discontinuity o… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [Idr] BGP MIBv2 discontinuity objects Jeffrey Haas