Re: Another attempt at plain language
John Cowan <cowan@mercury.ccil.org> Wed, 02 September 2015 18:47 UTC
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Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2015 13:31:59 -0400
From: John Cowan <cowan@mercury.ccil.org>
To: Doug Ewell <doug@ewellic.org>
Subject: Re: Another attempt at plain language
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Doug Ewell scripsit: > 1. the boundaries between "plain" and "non-plain" (obfuscated? > bureaucratic?) language are hard to define, and The boundaries between any two language varieties are hard to define, and neither we nor the ISO RAs generally demand that people who propose tags are able to do so. Looking at the Simple English Wikipedia <https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page> suggest that simple language (I prefer this term to plain language) is intended to be intelligible to people who have not mastered more complex forms of the language in question. The opposite of simple language is not necessarily bureaucratic or obfuscated; this posting is neither (having regard to the intended audience), but it is certainly not written in simple English. Compare the introduction to an article mentioned on the home page of the SEWP, "Aerogel", in English and Simple English. (start) Aerogel is a synthetic porous ultralight material derived from a gel, in which the liquid component of the gel has been replaced with a gas.[1] The result is a solid with extremely low density[2] and low thermal conductivity. Nicknames include frozen smoke,[3] solid smoke, solid air, or blue smoke owing to its translucent nature and the way light scatters in the material. It feels like fragile expanded polystyrene to the touch. Aerogels can be made from a variety of chemical compounds.[4] Aerogel was first created by Samuel Stephens Kistler in 1931, as a result of a bet[citation needed] with Charles Learned over who could replace the liquid in "jellies" with gas without causing shrinkage.[5][6] Aerogels are produced by extracting the liquid component of a gel through supercritical drying. This allows the liquid to be slowly dried off without causing the solid matrix in the gel to collapse from capillary action, as would happen with conventional evaporation. The first aerogels were produced from silica gels. Kistler's later work involved aerogels based on alumina, chromia and tin dioxide. Carbon aerogels were first developed in the late 1980s.[citation needed] Aerogel does not have a designated material with set chemical formula but the term is used to group all the material with a certain geometric structure.[7] (next) Aerogel is a gel in which the liquid part has been replaced with a gas (usually air). It was invented in 1931 by Samuel Stephens Kistler. The most common type of aerogel is silica aerogel, which is made from the same molecule as glass. It is a solid material that is almost as light as air. It is the world's lightest material.[1] Its melting point is 1200 degrees Celsius, which is comparable to crocidolite asbestos. Aerogel is the best thermal insulator available and can be used in construction in place of fiberglass insulation. It allows better insulation with less material, although it is much more expensive than fiberglass. It is also brittle, making it more difficult to install than fiberglass. Most aerogel is not water-resistant, and even small amounts of water can destroy it. It is also safer than fiberglass or asbestos because it is not known to cause cancer if inhaled into the lungs.[2] Some aerogel insulation, however, contains fiberglass to increase its flexibility. (end) I think it's clear enough which variety is which. > 2. "plain" English and "plain" German and "plain" Lavatbura-Lamusong > are fundamentally different languages, and variants that work across > languages usually require better commonality than this. Exactly what counts as simplicity is language-specific: in English, simple words are short words, but this would not be true in Malagasy. Nevertheless, I think simplicity can be defined in a cross-linguistic way by the intention of the writer. > In regard to (1), one could certainly expect a great deal of > disagreement over the definition "writing that is clear, concise, > well-organized, and follows other best practices appropriate to the > subject or field and intended audience." Does this post qualify? Does > yours? Who is the arbiter? You tag a page as German if you intended to write it in German, no matter how bad your German may be. Likewise with simple language. -- John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan@ccil.org Female celebrity stalker, on a hot morning in Cairo: "Imagine, Colonel Lawrence, ninety-two already!" El Auruns's reply: "Many happy returns of the day!"
- Another attempt at plain language Tobias Bengfort
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Doug Ewell
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Mark Davis ☕️
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Doug Ewell
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Phillips, Addison
- Re: Another attempt at plain language John Cowan
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Michael Everson
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Doug Ewell
- Re: Another attempt at plain language John Cowan
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Tobias Bengfort
- Re: Another attempt at plain language John Cowan
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Peter Constable
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Martin J. Dürst
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Mark Davis ☕️
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Michael Everson
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Mark Davis ☕️
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Doug Ewell
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Mark Davis ☕️
- RE: Another attempt at plain language CE Whitehead
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Doug Ewell
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Kent Karlsson
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Doug Ewell
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Tobias Bengfort
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Tobias Bengfort
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Kent Karlsson
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Kent Karlsson
- RE: Another attempt at plain language CE Whitehead
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Doug Ewell
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Doug Ewell
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- Re: Another attempt at plain language John Cowan
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- Re: Another attempt at plain language David Starner
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Tobias Bengfort
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Michael Everson
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Michael Everson
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Tobias Bengfort
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Michael Everson
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Mark Davis ☕️
- Re: Another attempt at plain language David Starner
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- Re: Another attempt at plain language John Cowan
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- Re: Another attempt at plain language John Cowan
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Doug Ewell
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Michael Everson
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Felix Sasaki
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Michael Everson
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Michael Everson
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Michael Everson
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Kent Karlsson
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Peter Constable
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Peter Constable
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Kent Karlsson
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Phillips, Addison
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Tobias Bengfort
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Peter Constable
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Peter Constable
- RE: Another attempt at plain language CE Whitehead
- RE: Another attempt at plain language Shawn Steele
- Re: Another attempt at plain language dzo
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Felix Sasaki
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Michael Everson
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Michael Everson
- Re: Another attempt at plain language Tobias Bengfort