Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first principles
Richard Clayton <richard@highwayman.com> Sun, 30 May 2021 08:19 UTC
Return-Path: <richard@highwayman.com>
X-Original-To: ietf-smtp@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf-smtp@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9D643A33E6 for <ietf-smtp@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 30 May 2021 01:19:49 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.899
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FgwmAmL4-Qo0 for <ietf-smtp@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 30 May 2021 01:19:45 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail.highwayman.com (mail.highwayman.com [82.69.6.249]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4D4493A33E3 for <ietf-smtp@ietf.org>; Sun, 30 May 2021 01:19:44 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50653 helo=happyday.al.cl.cam.ac.uk) by mail.highwayman.com with esmtp (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from <richard@highwayman.com>) id 1lnGfe-0005Xw-Ko for ietf-smtp@ietf.org; Sun, 30 May 2021 08:19:42 +0000
Message-ID: <lTVKiCHIp0sgFAPA@highwayman.com>
Date: Sun, 30 May 2021 09:18:16 +0100
To: IETF SMTP Mailing List <ietf-smtp@ietf.org>
From: Richard Clayton <richard@highwayman.com>
References: <F43E00C7D57DBDB88E527909@PSB>
In-Reply-To: <F43E00C7D57DBDB88E527909@PSB>
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Mailer: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.03 M <Ps+$+n4j77PLoMKLxGd+du8rf$>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-smtp/M8is8wN2M7nO5deOJOczavMDg1Q>
Subject: Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first principles
X-BeenThere: ietf-smtp@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "Discussion of issues related to Simple Mail Transfer Protocol \(SMTP\) \[RFC 821, RFC 2821, RFC 5321\]" <ietf-smtp.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf-smtp>, <mailto:ietf-smtp-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf-smtp/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf-smtp@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-smtp-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-smtp>, <mailto:ietf-smtp-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 30 May 2021 08:19:50 -0000
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 In message <F43E00C7D57DBDB88E527909@PSB>, John C Klensin <john- ietf@jck.com> writes >Even >some email providers are problematic: absent legal action, when >was the last time you heard of a major email provider closing an >account and deleting a mailbox because it was used as the reply >address in some phishing, extortion, or other fraudulent scheme? it's generally policy (on the advice of lawyers) for abuse@ reports to be replied to (if indeed they are at all) with a thank you note and an indication that appropriate action will be taken -- no more than that in practice, in my experience, reports of dropboxes accompanied by good evidence (and/or from trusted correspondents) are regularly acted upon by major email providers ... ... but it's not clear to me that even publishing summary statistics, let alone more detailed info, would assist anyone but the bad guys. BTW: I recall one early ransomware case where the mailbox was closed and this somewhat frustrated the victims, some of whom were prepared to pay. - -- richard Richard Clayton Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Benjamin Franklin 11 Nov 1755 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPsdk version 1.7.1 iQA/AwUBYLNKSN2nQQHFxEViEQKzDACdHJOFP5voSMK+ENW009ixSicaw4QAnixd 8G44SHqw6etR2HUPHspe7iy1 =ArcE -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
- [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first principles Kaspar Etter
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Bron Gondwana
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Alessandro Vesely
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Kaspar Etter
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Peter J. Holzer
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Sam Varshavchik
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Dave Crocker
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Dave Crocker
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… John R Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Sam Varshavchik
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Sam Varshavchik
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Dave Crocker
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Sam Varshavchik
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Dave Crocker
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Sam Varshavchik
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Dave Crocker
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Matthias Leisi
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Sam Varshavchik
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Dave Crocker
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Sam Varshavchik
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… Nathaniel Borenstein
- Re: [ietf-smtp] DKIM and DMARC, Email explained f… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Kaspar Etter
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… John R Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… John R Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Kaspar Etter
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… John R Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Richard Clayton
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Alessandro Vesely
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] the point of domain authentication John R Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] mailing lists are complicated, wa… John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] the point of domain authentication Sam Varshavchik
- Re: [ietf-smtp] the point of domain authentication John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] mailing lists are complicated, wa… Alessandro Vesely
- Re: [ietf-smtp] mailing lists are complicated, wa… John R Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] mailing lists are complicated, wa… Dave Crocker
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Email explained from first princi… Richard Clayton
- Re: [ietf-smtp] mailing lists are complicated, wa… Alessandro Vesely