Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techno.cat@gmail.com
Phillip Hallam-Baker <hallam@gmail.com> Tue, 22 October 2013 13:12 UTC
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Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2013 09:11:53 -0400
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Subject: Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techno.cat@gmail.com
From: Phillip Hallam-Baker <hallam@gmail.com>
To: Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com>
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On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 3:02 PM, Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com> wrote: > And we see below a perfect illustration of the difficulties that can > be caused by codification. > > - I am very suspicious of the word "professional". Who knows what the > hell it means? Is the previous sentence "unprofessionally" worded? If > you think so, good. I typically see "unprofesional" used as a cudgel > against the strong expression of opinions the critic does not like > when they have no real counter argument to those opinions. +1 There is a technique known as 'agenda denial' in which the way a proposition that can't be answered is addressed is to reject attempts to raise it. One of the examples used in the literature has to do with water rights in parts of Texas. There are existing homes without potable water and developers wanting to build new homes. The only way the politicians can achieve their desired outcome is to divide up the two questions so that these are never seen as alternatives. So it will never be the right day to talk about water rights for the existing residents. They will never raise the issue in precisely the correct form. I frequently see someone raise an issue repeatedly in the 'professional' way only to be dismissed or ignored or promised that something will get done when someone has time. Then they raise the same issue in a more aggressive way and are in effect told 'because you have behaved unprofessionally we are never going to address it'. Which is of course a catch 22 situation. The salaries of ISOC staff are a completely legit topic as far as I am concerned. It is a not for profit company and it is paying a very very large sum to the person in charge. Who is that person accountable to? Well, I was rather under the impression it was us. There are reasons to make anonymous postings and reasons to call ISOC staff to account. But there are no good reasons to make an anonymous call for accountability of a named person. On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 2:04 PM, Techno CAT <mars.techno.cat@gmail.com> > wrote: > > "Calling someone a troll is an ad hominem. We aren't supposed to do that > in > > the IETF. At least, not publicly."[1] > No, it is not ad hominem. Ad hominem is an argument of the form 'Hitler was a vegetarian, therefore vegetarians are NAZIs' This is an argument of the form 'Hitler was a NAZI' which is a completely valid statement of fact. > > "It is rude. > > It is bullying." [2] > > > > HARASSMENT by Brian E Carpenter has been noted for the Legal Record > That looks like a threat to me. Threats of legal action are certainly harassment. -- Website: http://hallambaker.com/
- Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techno.ca… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Techno CAT
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Donald Eastlake
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… JORDI PALET MARTINEZ
- Anonymous postings SM
- RE: Anonymous postings l.wood
- Re: Anonymous postings Melinda Shore
- Re: Anonymous postings Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Anonymous postings Melinda Shore
- RE: Anonymous postings SM
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Randy Bush
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Dave Crocker
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Barry Leiba
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Randy Bush
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Melinda Shore
- IETF::ISOC (was Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal… Dave Crocker
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… John C Klensin
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Randy Bush
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Scott Brim
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Ted Lemon
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with [censored] SM
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Jari Arkko
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Melinda Shore
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Melinda Shore
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Randy Bush
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Thomas Narten
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Ted Lemon
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Ted Lemon
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… John C Klensin
- RE: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… l.wood
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… JORDI PALET MARTINEZ
- RE: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Christian Huitema
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Masataka Ohta
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… joel jaeggli
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Melinda Shore
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with [censored] SM
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with [censored] Jorge Amodio
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Scott Brim
- RE: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Richard Shockey
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Ted Lemon
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Randy Bush
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Dave Crocker
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Douglas Otis
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… ned+ietf
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… John Levine
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Jorge Amodio
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Jorge Amodio
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Melinda Shore
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… David Conrad
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Roger Jørgensen
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Jorge Amodio
- On anonymity.... (was: Sergeant at arms: please d… Olaf Kolkman
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Douglas Otis
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Dan Harkins
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… TSG - personal
- Re: Sergeant at arms: please deal with mars.techn… Ted Lemon