Re: Enough DMARC whinging

Dave Cridland <dave@cridland.net> Mon, 05 May 2014 22:32 UTC

Return-Path: <dave@cridland.net>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A4661A03E1 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 5 May 2014 15:32:53 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -3.378
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.378 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pzZwW19-vLWx for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 5 May 2014 15:32:50 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-ob0-x22b.google.com (mail-ob0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4003:c01::22b]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B8C181A0195 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Mon, 5 May 2014 15:32:50 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-ob0-f171.google.com with SMTP id wn1so4489139obc.16 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Mon, 05 May 2014 15:32:47 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cridland.net; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=BUs9YZNW/EIOqsJ3e1iYsPBmrIxfT2KegfRCVEoKpjo=; b=h3g82Hqck+kR3w5cDT2NkQzQdrJgJr9xVGTQs6bB2brVNGwRjc+W5dre2Egv5Rqcmd u0rLavOfNr/1L+O2FKHZO6gWEVOj0obsOlYKpWot86lg3FxJy0HY6rDg5lTM0DOKiCkv eR2bmEEuWAyuwKNSNxm5OeNad9tsJ0Lt34D1w=
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=BUs9YZNW/EIOqsJ3e1iYsPBmrIxfT2KegfRCVEoKpjo=; b=YfXPc1PCKuzXfb7lAW8JWnrcXC1p39lmii+UaBW2phHkq+weX+RY+CM/fo1oFzUgW9 /DDR/KnB8hW79kiU1rMKecv4zIJgSEdEWM7W2wHQ6Db4cNbE3GtkPACOd/EliJ9OFICb o8lzYS4SFokPqVqsiA1f9NS3p6284V8Yo+Uc6nEcRlv1Omco43GXqJYAJreJOdIEoz/0 sxvIvV8GtEBNGjwuqArungppcK1o9MSt8a9ma7qeUU9bUfvGGfJer7AOiVxHmAQaxnbo FLvXkW7X6JRcFOQH3EXKPMDJhwMjWK1EO9WPzBIwy8S+Yph0M0Ee3baKJoAPwhjrMjnE 9gdA==
X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQlmZsDwkUD9nHG0cxFaSWNf493ArPiqMNBjLDrPu8XTpgbYLmcNaKAdQdARW5tcwTwLYhb4
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Received: by 10.182.231.138 with SMTP id tg10mr35057194obc.44.1399329167134; Mon, 05 May 2014 15:32:47 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.60.60.100 with HTTP; Mon, 5 May 2014 15:32:47 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <53680844.3030706@dcrocker.net>
References: <CAMm+Lwh0Sc2wtvjEAjOMi4emDzyF4JWmmzYr5QEFcmyoKtkTAA@mail.gmail.com> <CAMm+LwikJhO5R6UqWx8qUswMptgTw_wF6E6_9Ok=SRYTBChYgA@mail.gmail.com> <536113B1.5070309@bbiw.net> <CAMm+LwiXoW3p5uCmML4kAWXnbrrAnSCK9x5U2qeHJdVgR2r_Gg@mail.gmail.com> <E3A7C677B18263C8DF6DD316@JcK-HP8200.jck.com> <5362943D.2020907@bluepopcorn.net> <536295E5.3080502@dcrocker.net> <5362B4C6.10904@meetinghouse.net> <CAL0qLwb_UJrjViZwxrSC=y4y8geY8-N0QOHMeBski3dEuBqB6Q@mail.gmail.com> <CAL0qLwYPzfjPA6qBN=SXaJFvtYZcumRnZ5tCSNHbdw1r_hyG-w@mail.gmail.com> <CAKHUCzy=EFEiAR+hQt8WKE9YtpDhk7QgoLQXTKQZYzhWuW6+HQ@mail.gmail.com> <53680844.3030706@dcrocker.net>
Date: Mon, 05 May 2014 23:32:47 +0100
Message-ID: <CAKHUCzxk_pp-9_Z3afLk1_qkOzMcKowSTZu5SAvbkMsHuZoSXA@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Enough DMARC whinging
From: Dave Cridland <dave@cridland.net>
To: Dave Crocker <dcrocker@bbiw.net>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a11c32a96ee686504f8aeb506"
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/3aN1ZsrTRIhEx4K6_Hu4yulewsE
Cc: IETF general list <ietf@ietf.org>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 05 May 2014 22:32:53 -0000

On 5 May 2014 22:53, Dave Crocker <dhc@dcrocker.net> wrote:

> On 5/5/2014 1:17 PM, Dave Cridland wrote:
> > It aims to change the behaviour of Internet Mail as deployed.
> >
> > Whether you want to claim that this is formally extending SMTP, per-se,
> > or not is really something of a moot point - there is certainly an
> > intentional, large, effect on the deployed protocol. Arguing whether
> > this fits the letter of some particular definition smacks of lawyering
> > to my mind.
>
>
> If a large market player declared that all mail to and from them were
> required to be written in a specific language, would that we a matter
> for the IETF to deal with?  I think not.  (For all I know, some ISP out
> there already behaves that way.)
>
>
I think not too. Or either. Or neither. Whichever, that's an impressive
straw man, but largely unrelated to several market players working together
on a change in behaviour.

Dave.