Re: Adept Encryption: Was: [saag] DANE should be more prominent (Re: Review of: Opportunistic Security -03 preview for comment)

Scott Kitterman <scott@kitterman.com> Thu, 21 August 2014 04:37 UTC

Return-Path: <scott@kitterman.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7973C1A7013 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 20 Aug 2014 21:37:40 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.002
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.002 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ENu4XaaJJYEf for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 20 Aug 2014 21:37:38 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mailout03.controlledmail.com (mailout03.controlledmail.com [IPv6:2607:f0d0:3001:aa::2]) (using TLSv1.1 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B63721A701D for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 20 Aug 2014 21:37:38 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mailout03.controlledmail.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailout03.controlledmail.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40EFBD043C1; Thu, 21 Aug 2014 00:37:37 -0400 (EDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=kitterman.com; s=2014-01; t=1408595857; bh=WcG9qhxKVf3ljceR0ZAGNkGINDDscfwCca+g1sxWF50=; h=From:To:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=m+QrVgQ5meyFyD2gsRRC2x3L8s5KE5KhtjnwcmpkpIwRbTQEWQI2Bnuv3cL9eLOR6 7Q1rDrj8VWnZsKbVg1M5cMsEHWXtbIFmjC43C45jxVgqPozStZN0DHRyQ41MTsNqub gk4IyifX8zW0r5jBGEa3hyWaHBzF6OnchHoQqF3I=
Received: from scott-latitude-e6320.localnet (static-72-81-252-21.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net [72.81.252.21]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailout03.controlledmail.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0EB2FD04387; Thu, 21 Aug 2014 00:37:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: Scott Kitterman <scott@kitterman.com>
To: ietf@ietf.org
Subject: Re: Adept Encryption: Was: [saag] DANE should be more prominent (Re: Review of: Opportunistic Security -03 preview for comment)
Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2014 00:37:35 -0400
Message-ID: <70433085.aGCuFh2KAS@scott-latitude-e6320>
User-Agent: KMail/4.13.3 (Linux/3.13.0-34-generic; KDE/4.13.3; x86_64; ; )
In-Reply-To: <53F548E5.2070208@cs.tcd.ie>
References: <CAMm+Lwh1xzaxqqnnbdgFQrR0pWknsHru8zjnjCMVjihymXtKNw@mail.gmail.com> <alpine.LFD.2.10.1408202100590.6648@bofh.nohats.ca> <53F548E5.2070208@cs.tcd.ie>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
X-AV-Checked: ClamAV using ClamSMTP
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/4kSv6uKt7bW1zkpjE_xgWEzMK9c
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2014 04:37:40 -0000

On Thursday, August 21, 2014 02:18:29 Stephen Farrell wrote:
> Personally, I think the probability that we suddenly discover
> any significantly better term is negligible. Not because OS
> is super-good, but rather because nothing is super-good. And
> good-enough should be good-enough here.
> 
> In fact, I'd say so its so negligible that attempting to find
> such (yet again, maybe for the 8th time?) is counterproductive.
> 
> But that doesn't stop folks genuinely trying seemingly, I guess
> its too tempting a windmill at which to tilt;-)
> 
> But I'd appeal to others to consider this before they chime in
> here: is your suggestion really that much better that everyone
> will immediately say "yeah, that's the one we wanted!"? If not,
> them maybe there's not much point in suggesting it.
> 
> S.

I think -03 was an improvement over -02, but I think we're in danger of 
regressing.  I was able to find time to give the diff of the rewritten draft 
someone posted a quick read and my overall impression was that it did not 
represent progress.

That's an overly terse comment for the amount of effort that went into it, but 
that's all I have time for.

I think -03 does a reasonably good job of describing OS and we should call it  
mostly done.  

Scott K