Re: [Recentattendees] Remote Participation for IETF 95: Meetecho Details

Melinda Shore <melinda.shore@nomountain.net> Thu, 31 March 2016 18:55 UTC

Return-Path: <melinda.shore@nomountain.net>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3033B12D752 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 31 Mar 2016 11:55:08 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.6
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=nomountain-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id laajSJf5gCx0 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 31 Mar 2016 11:55:05 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pf0-x235.google.com (mail-pf0-x235.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c00::235]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D8D7F12D754 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Thu, 31 Mar 2016 11:55:05 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pf0-x235.google.com with SMTP id 4so75622783pfd.0 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Thu, 31 Mar 2016 11:55:05 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=nomountain-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=9Q+0zNj46h8N69q1VaDV+RMDaoCEVV0ClUARIz3RUoc=; b=UROes1jj9dbcdkR9S2fEBEQNsjmECAiofSMLa+kHfzNRokBcMiAAgPMHjyUp20I9Ef 1WfHDf2oOU6nIe4JLWjdd9NBfDieRrhtilItKBRdp0c80peyFv2KhKjfrzu1ejnQgjGv kmXsKFkqI8KTFFjiMET14nan+tSRpPq+kk5uP0dd1hdF/NPdwWuwt0MAZBequh7ZXLQz AtV+8l6x6j8dMpozYn6572tkFrwouzM7QvNlJBGMuglYcWsKcVUYE6gMTj3fIHH2uwFw Tk84Xd+47pRlA9oYaURGbYM+DMyxChUbKbw2QnRCYobINZOzMVuYEkWM+3YQtLR7Zhki JpeA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=9Q+0zNj46h8N69q1VaDV+RMDaoCEVV0ClUARIz3RUoc=; b=UrG/V0wRvN39KvJAtAySAJCyKRI+CRrVhrJMkD5KIQpHotyJ+L9tjjVE9C9C2CHDlQ IDwUL1Y/M1TWT0rVrQ6UvJ0E7szNpQ4diffGduZDLrBfNoe3E+RzeNrAyEBcRtsMehKb N6ou/hGbm/j+v0ZRq4zD11dGGzqLsdPpxpHU1rfp8OXq4jRfCvNUoyJez1CMcrydAvIa JbD1YaOdWhvMu/G8K9d5xs92VPYQCL/djBoB58x6lm1Lw818WW93mqTDXmyf3LhA5ZfA NGEr5gpvUKVGDJgy6BO2oXMBnsmb0xyjuj5A/pmd6+e6B+wOyPhFvw1OQF3+GRQvjT15 FydQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: AD7BkJLjZbOLjwg+gyfj402ATHMO1r8cDATIN4jarw3jnGo0n79Kd4g4IxEY/IFpCygL2w==
X-Received: by 10.98.32.211 with SMTP id m80mr24379972pfj.3.1459450505507; Thu, 31 Mar 2016 11:55:05 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from Melindas-MacBook-Pro.local (216-67-20-107-radius.dynamic.acsalaska.net. [216.67.20.107]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id q2sm15100051pfq.88.2016.03.31.11.55.04 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 31 Mar 2016 11:55:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: [Recentattendees] Remote Participation for IETF 95: Meetecho Details
To: John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com>, ietf@ietf.org
References: <20160330202243.4795.63685.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <56FC7167.4010409@nomountain.net> <A4B09E64B56CD0B8C4379A99@JcK-HP8200.jck.com>
From: Melinda Shore <melinda.shore@nomountain.net>
Message-ID: <56FD72BC.1070402@nomountain.net>
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2016 10:55:56 -0800
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.9; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.6.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <A4B09E64B56CD0B8C4379A99@JcK-HP8200.jck.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/5BOL4AynNwTEgFY83nc1xM_TEAk>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2016 18:55:08 -0000

On 3/31/16 10:29 AM, John C Klensin wrote:
> A registration requirement for remote participants is a major
> policy change and one for people who merely want to passively
> observe is something I believe the community has several times
> concluded is inappropriate given privacy, etc., concerns.

Yes, and inconsistent with the recent apparent consensus that
someone will be whitelisted for all IETF mailing lists if they're
signed up for any.

I do think there ought to be registration for people who are
active participants and who may influence outcomes - there are
tradeoffs around accountability and privacy that kick in in
that circumstance.  I don't think those tradeoffs apply to
merely consuming information.

In particular, I think it's weird and represents somewhat
incoherent engineering decisions to require registration to
passively monitor a session via Meetecho but not the raw
audio feed, and that no registration is required to watch
a recording.  Note that this is *not* an argument in favor of
requiring registration for access to archived material, but
that the registration requirement should be restricted to the
mike queue (although that raises the question of what to do
about questions relayed via Jabber).

As a frequent remote participant I'm very, very happy to see
that there's been progress on improving tools for allowing
remote participants to be more active during a session, but
as always seems to happen, the details are messy.

Melinda