Re: Montevideo statement
Jari Arkko <jari.arkko@piuha.net> Thu, 10 October 2013 21:32 UTC
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Subject: Re: Montevideo statement
From: Jari Arkko <jari.arkko@piuha.net>
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Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2013 00:32:41 +0300
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Dave, > The fact that you had to reach back 2.5 years, to a frankly rather obscure document that came from the IAB and not the broader IETF, demonstrates my point that we lacked meaningful context You asked for context and I provided a context. We can certainly debate how meaningful it is. There are obvious arguments that we can make against its meaningfulness. But I disagree with your characterisation of the most recent RFC (6020) on topic from the organisation that in the IETF ecosystem has IANA oversight in its charter (per RFC 2580, a BCP) as "obscure". In any case I don't want to argue too much, because I _do_ agree with your larger points: > They don't set work agendas. They don't control overall budgets. They don't hire and fire people. For almost all of the formal IETF 'decisions' they participate in, it is with exactly one vote in a group, and not more authority than that. ... > IETF leaders are best viewed as facilitators, rather than leaders. They do huge amounts of organizing, coordinating, interfacing, in the classic style of the cliche'd 'shepherding cats'. Although I would claim that while there is no traditional "leading" at the IETF, I do think that IETF facilitators do occasionally lead in the sense of suggesting paths forward, identifying potential challenges, etc. And I of course would love to have this: > We need to find some sort of language that gives constructive guidance and constraint about public representations of the IETF, by our 'leaders'. Jari
- Re: Montevideo statement Noel Chiappa
- Montevideo statement IETF Chair
- Re: Montevideo statement Stephane Bortzmeyer
- Re: Montevideo statement Jari Arkko
- Re: Montevideo statement Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: Montevideo statement Martin Millnert
- Re: Montevideo statement Tobias Gondrom
- Re: Montevideo statement manning bill
- Re: Montevideo statement Michael Richardson
- Re: Montevideo statement Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: Montevideo statement Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: Montevideo statement manning bill
- Re: Montevideo statement SM
- Re: Montevideo statement Andrew Sullivan
- Re: Montevideo statement joel jaeggli
- Re: Montevideo statement Ted Lemon
- Re: Montevideo statement John C Klensin
- Re: Montevideo statement Tobias Gondrom
- Re: Montevideo statement Russ Housley
- Re: Montevideo statement joel jaeggli
- leader statements (was: Montevideo statement) Andrew Sullivan
- Re: Montevideo statement Arturo Servin
- Re: Montevideo statement SM
- Re: Montevideo statement Russ Housley
- Re: leader statements Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Montevideo statement Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: leader statements Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: leader statements Bjoern Hoehrmann
- Re: leader statements Brian E Carpenter
- "The core Internet institutions abandon the US Go… Carsten Bormann
- Re: leader statements Scott Brim
- Re: leader statements (was: Montevideo statement) SM
- Re: leader statements (was: Montevideo statement) Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: leader statements (was: Montevideo statement) Jari Arkko
- Re: Montevideo statement Medel v6 Ramirez
- Re: Montevideo statement Dave Crocker
- Re: leader statements manning bill
- Re: leader statements Arturo Servin
- Re: leader statements (was: Montevideo statement) manning bill
- Re: leader statements Melinda Shore
- Re: Montevideo statement Jari Arkko
- Re: Montevideo statement Ted Lemon
- Re: leader statements Carlos M. Martinez
- Re: Montevideo statement Dave Crocker
- Re: Montevideo statement Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: Montevideo statement SM
- Re: Montevideo statement Jari Arkko
- Re: "The core Internet institutions abandon the U… Jorge Amodio
- Re: "The core Internet institutions abandon the U… John Levine
- Re: leader statements Suzanne Woolf
- Re: "The core Internet institutions abandon the U… Jorge Amodio
- Re: "The core Internet institutions abandon the U… Dave Crocker
- Re: "The core Internet institutions abandon the U… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: Montevideo statement Michael Richardson
- Re: Montevideo statement Jari Arkko
- Re: Montevideo statement John C Klensin
- Re: Montevideo statement Randy Bush
- Re: [IETF] Re: Montevideo statement Warren Kumari
- Re: Montevideo statement Jorge Amodio
- Re: [IETF] Re: Montevideo statement shogunx