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Re: Call for Community Feedback: Retiring IETF FTP Service

Greg Skinner <gregskinner0@icloud.com> Wed, 02 December 2020 01:45 UTC

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From: Greg Skinner <gregskinner0@icloud.com>
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Subject: Re: Call for Community Feedback: Retiring IETF FTP Service
Date: Tue, 01 Dec 2020 17:45:40 -0800
In-Reply-To: <20201113180151.AF0EE26FB007@ary.qy>
Cc: IETF Rinse Repeat <ietf@ietf.org>
To: John Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
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> On Nov 13, 2020, at 10:01 AM, John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
> 
> In article <60648e0e-55d6-86a1-e40f-342133110f9d@network-heretics.com> you write:
>> On 11/11/20 10:40 PM, Roman Danyliw wrote:
>> 
>>> As noted in the proposal, ALL data is available at least two other ways (https://www.ietf.org/ietf-ftp  or rsync).  By request
>> volume, HTTPS is massively preferred (FTP is 0.2% of HTTPS document traffic, and this is undercounting HTTPS usage) by the vast
>> majority of users.  If the bulk download semantics are desired, to include incremental updates with no code required, then rsync is
>> the best choice.  Do you have a user community in mind that can use FTP, but not HTTPS or rsync that we need to consider?
>> 
>> rsync is not nearly as widely supported as FTP.   And while rsync works 
>> okay for mirroring, I've never seen it used for remote file access.
> 
> This makes no sense. What computers do you believe that people use in
> 2020 that support FTP but not rsync? And if that were true, why do we
> see orders of magnitude more rsync traffic than FTP?

John, if you mean “What distributions out-of-the-box offer FTP but not rsync?”, I poked around NetBSD a bit and found that
one can build an ftp client binary from its sources, but couldn’t find the rsync sources in any of the “usual” places.  On the other hand, I imagine it is possible to get rsync sources from some other (related) BSD distribution and build its binary with perhaps a bit of extra work.

> I use a Mac laptop which, based on what I've seen at IETF meetings, is
> a fairly popular choice.  It has rsync as part of the base system, and
> no FTP client other than as part of curl, which of course also supports
> http and https.

AFAIK, ftp client functionality is available in Catalina and later MacOS releases through the Zftp Function System <https://www.csse.uwa.edu.au/programming/linux/zsh-doc/zsh_24.html>.  It also may be available depending upon which Perl, Python, or Tcl packages are installed.

—gregbo

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