Re: NomCom procedures revision

Mary Barnes <mary.h.barnes@gmail.com> Fri, 28 August 2015 22:17 UTC

Return-Path: <mary.h.barnes@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F3C21A8790 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 28 Aug 2015 15:17:11 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.999
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YYdL9YF9Ghwx for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 28 Aug 2015 15:17:09 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-wi0-x236.google.com (mail-wi0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c05::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3CF451B301E for <ietf@ietf.org>; Fri, 28 Aug 2015 15:17:09 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by wicne3 with SMTP id ne3so29743549wic.0 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Fri, 28 Aug 2015 15:17:08 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=LArMPZbH9xuR4W3mRxGhktKh1wjhf0UDYo8sgxOql20=; b=imJVLqQowYpCVkVtQk86aEPMoRTfLWWXgtsN18H1K4x0RUoqWhfOvQcVSK5X2EKXoV G2aT8zm+Jbgo3qtR66gK/mluDi2tDoDEi4VYm/1A56ruteYqaBOEx5AS9WQ7jyHlk372 sElm5H/IP8xlv0UIWJXsuK4IcQuaGv6oXO2VY9JbwPzqkp/X+I1TpIG5aWC25KQxFzvj SKd2EFgOXF7PD1eTf5RBX5LQzU+b86SxXnT5Dr4cBlP2LdnhAvGVRdZtpLxcyrz+X+K+ d9sZgaocQlaA79KeHNgyy9FDzPoaORrKq+1qKywSv0l0x1caflVhdRrXfltz1LHjP2N1 l40Q==
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Received: by 10.180.83.137 with SMTP id q9mr7159168wiy.68.1440800227921; Fri, 28 Aug 2015 15:17:07 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.28.220.132 with HTTP; Fri, 28 Aug 2015 15:17:07 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <55E0DC42.2020303@joelhalpern.com>
References: <CAL0qLwYJzFZT=OgWqiiTw-n6mvb3PPusRtArmPs_d4_qpLfmpg@mail.gmail.com> <CADnDZ8_KsNP=_nwp2wrckXtHF8ZSxrQTvf9UKbAMpt68BiiCFA@mail.gmail.com> <CAL0qLwbhhqG1qoHbBrymPQrU31qjswPAhdeJBqVdRj2L4AR80A@mail.gmail.com> <55E0426A.3000800@alvestrand.no> <55E063DC.3020503@dcrocker.net> <087d01d0e1db$a5b0f6f0$f112e4d0$@olddog.co.uk> <55E0DC42.2020303@joelhalpern.com>
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2015 17:17:07 -0500
Message-ID: <CABmDk8nh2RvSMN9qKfRgL7H1f5HK5JShp5d4_qhjY++JUXdkvA@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: NomCom procedures revision
From: Mary Barnes <mary.h.barnes@gmail.com>
To: Joel Halpern <jmh@joelhalpern.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f46d04440196c715bf051e667108"
Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/D9MZHCoqYUGitYha_Lh9bP0y9qE>
Cc: ietf <ietf@ietf.org>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2015 22:17:11 -0000

I have the exact same question and concern with regards to being overly
prescriptive.    Was this proposal intended to solve a problem experienced
by a past Nomcom?

Regards,
Mary.

On Fri, Aug 28, 2015 at 5:10 PM, Joel Halpern <jmh@joelhalpern.com> wrote:

> I was a bit confused by this discussion.  By 3777, the chair establishes
> the voting procedure.  By assumption, he establishes it before it is needed.
>
> A sensible chair will establish procedures that the committee is
> comfortable with.  Since it is the chair who will administer whatever
> proecedures are used, it eh committee does not trust the chair to establsih
> them, why would the committee trust the chair to adminsiter them?
>
> I would hate to have an overly strict rule on voting procedures, and a
> couple of nomcom members get into a typical IETF dispute about the best
> answer, and thereby hang the work of the nomcom.
>
> Why is this being made more complex, with strict priority, strict rules on
> adoption, etc?
>
> Yours,
> Joel
>
>
> On 8/28/15 5:51 PM, Adrian Farrel wrote:
>
>> On 8/28/2015 4:13 AM, Harald Alvestrand wrote:
>>>
>>>> Once established, this procedure
>>>>     cannot be altered until the current nominating committee is
>>>>     dissolved.
>>>>
>>>> A) It turns out that voting mechanisms are *tricky* beasts. The idea
>>>> that a nomcom will make them 100% right on the first try is a Bad Idea.
>>>>
>>>
>>> That assertion would seem to run contrary to the process rigidity you
>>> are proposing above.
>>>
>>
>> Indeed.
>> One would hope that a NomCom that discovers it is really unhappy with its
>> voting mechanism can use exactly that voting mechanism to agree to make
>> changes.
>>
>> Adrian
>>
>>
>>
>