Re: WG Review: Behavior Engineering for Hindrance Avoidance (behave) (fwd)

Harald Tveit Alvestrand <harald@alvestrand.no> Tue, 21 September 2004 11:14 UTC

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Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 13:02:03 +0200
From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand <harald@alvestrand.no>
To: Pekka Savola <pekkas@netcore.fi>
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Cc: Michael Richardson <mcr@sandelman.ottawa.on.ca>, ietf@ietf.org
Subject: Re: WG Review: Behavior Engineering for Hindrance Avoidance (behave) (fwd)
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--On tirsdag, september 21, 2004 13:55:10 +0300 Pekka Savola 
<pekkas@netcore.fi> wrote:

> (Removed Cc: iesg)
>
> On Mon, 20 Sep 2004, Harald Tveit Alvestrand wrote:
>> --On mandag, september 20, 2004 14:38:51 -0400 Michael Richardson
>> <mcr@sandelman.ottawa.on.ca> wrote:
>> >     Harald> And - here I am making a real leap of faith - if the IETF
>> >     Harald> recommendations for NAT devices make manufacturers who
>> >     Harald> listen to them create NAT devices that make their customers
>> >     Harald> more happy, then many of these new NAT devices may be
>> >     Harald> conformant to IETF recommendations.
>> >
>> >   Do we really want customers of NAT devices to be happy?
>>
>> Given that I'm one of them, and will continue to be one until the IPv4
>> Internet fades to where I can ignore it.... yes.
>
> The point is not whether the users behind an IPv4 NAT are happy or
> not.
>
> The point is which kind of applications you can reasonably expect to
> deploy behind an IPv4 NAT, and be happy.
>
> I agree with Harald that v4 NATs are going to be here a decade from
> now.  But that's irrelevant, if those people using the NAT only use
> simple client-server applications.

Well.... my house was behind 2 levels of NAT until last week.
Once i got rid of one level (the one I don't control), some of my 
operational problems with keeping SSH sessions up simply went away.
And SSH is a client-server protocol.

Don't underestimate the capability of badly implemented and/or configured 
NATs to make things go boom in the night.

                        Harald




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