IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: BCP 83 PR actions and new media

Paul Wouters <paul@nohats.ca> Thu, 10 November 2022 19:13 UTC

Return-Path: <paul@nohats.ca>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A0ACC14F740 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 10 Nov 2022 11:13:48 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.104
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.104 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, URIBL_DBL_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, URIBL_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nohats.ca
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UG6P_R33wk49 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 10 Nov 2022 11:13:43 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mx.nohats.ca (mx.nohats.ca [193.110.157.85]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5F7CDC14CE22 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Thu, 10 Nov 2022 11:13:43 -0800 (PST)
Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by mx.nohats.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4N7Whj2TqRz3sk; Thu, 10 Nov 2022 20:13:41 +0100 (CET)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=nohats.ca; s=default; t=1668107621; bh=67Wg+jRvO7o3ji6ckGbZBFxzvj29av9ceOJvoy9R5ho=; h=From:Subject:Date:References:Cc:In-Reply-To:To; b=ivPNHcI3L9fd893qwZHV0SqMl8BlBrOWcrh3mlbdN+nPZWcNO+m71xTpLRQIWMlab jjpEeSJkGvu2riPx8NDzw8DaV1Rbe/mjQMWSYfAv2RkIs23+H/C7eQ9xdgrtiTx3AV mr+hrpDocZZETIsWgqBaRdlJRvKuESvcVkBE3+qc=
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at mx.nohats.ca
Received: from mx.nohats.ca ([IPv6:::1]) by localhost (mx.nohats.ca [IPv6:::1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 96p_Ns8lvk_Z; Thu, 10 Nov 2022 20:13:40 +0100 (CET)
Received: from bofh.nohats.ca (bofh.nohats.ca [193.110.157.194]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx.nohats.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPS; Thu, 10 Nov 2022 20:13:40 +0100 (CET)
Received: from smtpclient.apple (dhcp-9140.meeting.ietf.org [31.133.145.64]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by bofh.nohats.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5A4D7408C2B; Thu, 10 Nov 2022 14:13:39 -0500 (EST)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
From: Paul Wouters <paul@nohats.ca>
Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0)
Subject: Re: BCP 83 PR actions and new media
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 19:13:35 +0000
Message-Id: <BD239214-41C1-4FCF-B46F-A01CED91E175@nohats.ca>
References: <PAXPR07MB7999F3952D0BB22C1435312A92019@PAXPR07MB7999.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com>
Cc: ietf@ietf.org
In-Reply-To: <PAXPR07MB7999F3952D0BB22C1435312A92019@PAXPR07MB7999.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com>
To: "Maisonneuve, Julien (Nokia - FR/Massy)" <julien.maisonneuve@nokia.com>
X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (19G82)
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/GtKPmjQ47TElOX8KcEdoWe1XNEc>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: "IETF-Discussion. This is the most general IETF mailing list, intended for discussion of technical, procedural, operational, and other topics for which no dedicated mailing lists exist." <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 19:13:48 -0000

Speaking with no hats,


On Nov 10, 2022, at 11:40, Maisonneuve, Julien (Nokia - FR/Massy) <julien.maisonneuve@nokia.com> wrote:
> 
> . Considering the importance of mailing lists for work in IETF, this can be considered a drastic penalty.


> However here we're going to a different level where you are effectively preventing someone to work with IETF in any way.

Since “all work happens on the list”, I would argue that GitHub posting rights or Zulyp or jabber posting rights are equivalent.

> For some it could be equivalent to losing your job. 
> I feel we're losing the indispensable proportionality of the sanction.

I dont feel that way. This process starts only after many warnings to the individual, and that process already has an increased proportionality.

Paul

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email