Re: Quic: the elephant in the room

Stephane Bortzmeyer <bortzmeyer@nic.fr> Sat, 10 April 2021 09:50 UTC

Return-Path: <bortzmeyer@nic.fr>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BDDB3A2C88 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 10 Apr 2021 02:50:00 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.898
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id W-pIrywxVOIX for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 10 Apr 2021 02:49:54 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mx4.nic.fr (mx4.nic.fr [IPv6:2001:67c:2218:2::4:12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A10CE3A2C85 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Sat, 10 Apr 2021 02:49:54 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mx4.nic.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mx4.nic.fr (Postfix) with SMTP id C3692281360; Sat, 10 Apr 2021 11:49:50 +0200 (CEST)
Received: by mx4.nic.fr (Postfix, from userid 500) id BCBBD281387; Sat, 10 Apr 2021 11:49:50 +0200 (CEST)
Received: from relay01.prive.nic.fr (relay01.prive.nic.fr [IPv6:2001:67c:2218:15::11]) by mx4.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id B542D281360; Sat, 10 Apr 2021 11:49:50 +0200 (CEST)
Received: from b12.nic.fr (b12.users.prive.nic.fr [10.10.86.133]) by relay01.prive.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id B173B60911A0; Sat, 10 Apr 2021 11:49:50 +0200 (CEST)
Received: by b12.nic.fr (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 9FD193FE77; Sat, 10 Apr 2021 11:49:25 +0200 (CEST)
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2021 11:49:25 +0200
From: Stephane Bortzmeyer <bortzmeyer@nic.fr>
To: Ben Laurie <benl=40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org>
Cc: Michael Thomas <mike@mtcc.com>, Phillip Hallam-Baker <phill@hallambaker.com>, IETF Discussion Mailing List <ietf@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: Quic: the elephant in the room
Message-ID: <20210410094925.GA8697@nic.fr>
References: <3b25c77d-e721-e86d-6c34-a90039aab0e2@mtcc.com> <CAMm+Lwhi8xwFgZJL7jod2g4urZt_f+dm0tNi+3y1osqOfch2mQ@mail.gmail.com> <3593a01f-73f4-7d03-a85b-dff64a8b070e@mtcc.com> <CABrd9STZXonBDvWB7Z36H2mD20Juubc01TUmEvpfWkvJggQVOQ@mail.gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Disposition: inline
In-Reply-To: <CABrd9STZXonBDvWB7Z36H2mD20Juubc01TUmEvpfWkvJggQVOQ@mail.gmail.com>
X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 10.9
X-Kernel: Linux 4.19.0-16-amd64 x86_64
X-Charlie: Je suis Charlie
Organization: NIC France
X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/
User-Agent: Mutt/1.10.1 (2018-07-13)
X-Bogosity: No, tests=bogofilter, spamicity=0.000011, version=1.2.2
X-PMX-Version: 6.4.9.2830568, Antispam-Engine: 2.7.2.2107409, Antispam-Data: 2021.4.10.94215, AntiVirus-Engine: 5.82.0, AntiVirus-Data: 2021.4.10.5820000
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/IT-VUgKCgZSG0SRWqicPBvOktPQ>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2021 09:50:00 -0000

On Sat, Apr 10, 2021 at 10:29:42AM +0100,
 Ben Laurie <benl=40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote 
 a message of 138 lines which said:

> However, the other problem is introducing DNS as a trust root - the
> DNS hierarchy is considerably less secure than CAs were even before
> CT but now it's really a very poor option in comparison.

It doesn't matter since, if you control the DNS, you can have your
certificate, anyway. So, it doesn't change the picture.