Level of consultation (Re: a note about the scenarios)

John,

picking on one of your topics as usual:

--On 24. september 2004 16:01 -0400 John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com> 
wrote:

> (5) Has there been as much transparency and efforts to inform
> and educate the community about this process as it requires, as
> the traditions of the IETF dictate, and as the community has
> been promised?
>
> While there is a need for confidentiality about some things, I
> believe the community is entitled to know what topics have been
> singled out for discussion in confidence.  More generally, I
> think the answers to the above questions are "no", "no", and
> "no", partially because I don't believe the community ever
> authorized the IAB and IESG to go off on this adventure (that
> position differs very significantly from one of Harald's
> "obvious" positions which, if read carefully, implies the right
> and responsibility of the IETF and IAB Chairs to make a decision
> on these issues and implement it with little consultation of the
> IAB and IESG and very little consultation with the community.

My impression of the average impression of the level of consultation both 
within the IESG and IAB and outside it is better represented by Fred 
Templin's follow-up:

> Maybe I'm wrong, but I get the sense that the general populous has been
> and is continuing to get snowed under with way too much verbiage on this
> subject to derive any kind of an informed opinion. Any ideas on how it
> can  all be distilled into a paragraph or two?

I'm afraid I haven't found the magic paragraphs.

One possible reason why I've been so often charged with keeping secrets may 
be that people are secretly hoping that I have a grand secret plan that 
will solve everything in my back pocket, and am just waiting for the right 
moment to pull it out.... I am sorry - I don't have the plan. What you see 
is what there is, give or take a relatively small delta.

And - while I don't think John really means that - what I could read into 
John's remark as the extreme position is that NOBODY could take a decision 
to "go off on this adventure" - we just have to let the IETF go to hell in 
a handbasket, and let the IETF community reach consensus that this was a 
sad result.

Sorry - I'd rather be hanged for trying.

                     Harald

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