Re: tone policing

Keith Moore <moore@network-heretics.com> Tue, 03 September 2019 13:51 UTC

Return-Path: <moore@network-heretics.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22CD512018B for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 3 Sep 2019 06:51:18 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.599
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_NONE=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MgamXKTCtQlz for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 3 Sep 2019 06:51:08 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from out4-smtp.messagingengine.com (out4-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.28]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 32905120118 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Tue, 3 Sep 2019 06:51:08 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B3CE222C4; Tue, 3 Sep 2019 09:51:07 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 03 Sep 2019 09:51:07 -0400
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :subject:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender :x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=j2hgsoc7pslXRLlgIC4XbUnwD/JkQMfnonWuy1wWE ss=; b=hRbpnYf7e1nATFPwjkGYpA9aNQFQjuSdmSLG4B2YiIxw4xxjpddnK6Mo/ W7DCgFeQ0/xKoCOrDT97VkMpSai1lsOmVwVv3LupKTMjldBA8Kp3jOSffpu2AQGc HxGcARaHIlwP+er/w91ckLkemC9yOzO1hRq3wsDO+WkAOtP0/nmOM4mJfJr9f1ze L7/8IS9O8BaxIKlFRFZCBgmtfQefar2lohvKryWp4CXChriI4NHQAebQYaoJlWSP NvLlS2zwSSctrpV/+XmxbcInxJCF1mWUDL2RlGsQEtqUdqTImsp0hIXIPArQ/dN+ yiuRJXjCE1CxdEHSLjw4KlMKyT54Q==
X-ME-Sender: <xms:ym9uXVy9IW3qofHpyRsVF7yVktHEBXwM2DEqrqd0t6Hu8bmwg4tLeg>
X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgeduvddrudejfedggedtucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefuvfhfhffkffgfgggjtgfgsehtke ertddtfeejnecuhfhrohhmpefmvghithhhucfoohhorhgvuceomhhoohhrvgesnhgvthif ohhrkhdqhhgvrhgvthhitghsrdgtohhmqeenucfkphepuddtkedrvddvuddrudektddrud ehnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehmohhorhgvsehnvghtfihorhhkqdhhvghr vghtihgtshdrtghomhenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt
X-ME-Proxy: <xmx:ym9uXY-JvxfVP6iKJ4NdXiU4Lg80DDmxUaqU1_7WW22MZsIVLilapw> <xmx:ym9uXZJmu0zA_icmFyhXupqXOuFXw81VeYMQnuaCxndsfjL8eOm-bQ> <xmx:ym9uXedHdxjZZBzJcSPsxwsu-vqXdNvX3VbmHdO_puu1RnfdVpXsEQ> <xmx:y29uXdxUeQnBfkv-lmPi9aRL1slwxnKMRpPlCmrMqM1SOiy_9J4Yig>
Received: from [192.168.1.66] (108-221-180-15.lightspeed.knvltn.sbcglobal.net [108.221.180.15]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 5AA8A80061; Tue, 3 Sep 2019 09:51:06 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: tone policing
To: ietf@ietf.org
References: <F2D6FBAB-7DED-41AE-9560-4D0D13B15107@ericsson.com> <1BF349D9-8ABB-4844-965A-A43964E18A41@fugue.com>
From: Keith Moore <moore@network-heretics.com>
Message-ID: <29c10b3d-8f48-8888-68c9-7390b1e4df5d@network-heretics.com>
Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2019 09:51:05 -0400
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.8.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <1BF349D9-8ABB-4844-965A-A43964E18A41@fugue.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Content-Language: en-US
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/P_1TM7MklDWbLvQ8Q98VmRbEMy4>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2019 13:51:18 -0000

On 9/3/19 9:37 AM, Ted Lemon wrote:

> The problem generally is that there are ways to take up more than your fair share of the space in the conversation. This is one. If there is no regulation of this behavior it disenfranchises people who have work to do: precisely the people we want participating.

If you want people to participate, maybe you shouldn't be arguing in 
favor of censorship for arbitrary reasons.   And maybe you shouldn't be 
trying to shout down people who are against that.

Keith