Re: New Approach For Discussing IPng

[Phillip Hallam-Baker <[e-mail]>]

On Mon, Apr 19, 2021 at 12:53 AM Brian E Carpenter <
[e-mail]> wrote:

> I've been keeping clear of this thread, but I think Phill does remind us
> of an important point (hence the small change of subject):
>

I have also been avoiding the issue raised, But the peculiar fact that
there is so little can be done at that level in the stack did seem worth
mention...

The only scope for innovation I can see in the space is to drop the source
address from data packets... And that is not one I care to attempt for
obvious reasons even when that is exactly what I am doing at the
transport/presentation layer.



> On 19-Apr-21 15:42, Phillip Hallam-Baker wrote:
> ...
> > We keep having people coming along making these suggestions for IPv8,
> IPv10, etc. etc. and the inventors never once seem fit to ask what is so
> different about their proposal it can't be done in IPv6.
>
> Back in 1994, it had become clear that deploying new header options in
> IPv4 across the Internet was in practice impossible, however well they
> worked in the lab. Extending IPv4 was therefore theoretically possible but
> impossible in reality. So we started IPv6.
>
> 27 years later, it has become clear that deploying new extension headers
> in IPv6 across the Internet is in practice impossible, however well they
> work in the lab.
>

Like multicast, the deployment requires substantial cooperation between
commercial entities which are competitors who won't even share their
network maps...

How can we expect Internet QoS to work when ISPs can't even be bothered to
police source packet address declarations on broadband network gateways?


I do not accept everyone's interpretation of 'end to end' but I do accept
that what happens on the network and what happens on the inter-network have
to be rather different. Einar Stefferud had a good presentation explaining
why this is the case.

Where I depart from end-to-end absolutism is that I recognize the network
interfaces as being places where 'different' things can and in some cases
MUST happen. I do not want every coffee pot on my network to have full
Internet access. That would be silly and break the least privilege
principle.