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Re: Terminology discussion threads

Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in> Fri, 14 August 2020 02:13 UTC

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From: Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in>
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Subject: Re: Terminology discussion threads
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2020 22:13:41 -0400
References: <9ABDC2BC-E6A3-4249-99C5-F0BB3683A03D@ietf.org> <6AA0BCBB-D95B-4036-B94D-5E79E7B94D75@ietf.org> <20200814020459.GH3100@localhost> <682B60BF-563C-4995-B7AE-ABE5B9ED7C7E@dukhovni.org>
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So sorry for the offense, I will refrain from posting as much as possible going forward.

Alissa

> On Aug 13, 2020, at 10:11 PM, Viktor Dukhovni <ietf-dane@dukhovni.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
>> On Aug 14, 2020, at 12:05 AM, Nico Williams <nico@cryptonector.com> wrote:
>> 
>> On Thu, Aug 13, 2020 at 09:48:30PM -0400, IETF Chair wrote:
>>> I believe we wind up in this kind of situation over and over because
>>> IETF participants have no shared norms about respecting each other or
>>> demonstrating empathy towards one another. With no norms about
>>> respecting one another as human beings, no value assigned to composing
>>> thoughtful replies, and no expectation of simply treating each other
>>> with kindness on the list, our discussions devolve into toxic, snarky,
>>> knee-jerk back-and-forth. Without norms, processes like the one
>>> established in RFC 3005 are not worth much.
>> 
>> This is the least empathic message in all of this thread.
>> 
>> Some of us have been quite polite, professional, and reasoned in our
>> positions that do not support yours.  We get no credit.  Instead we see
>> insinuations and bullying by the leadership and others.
> 
> Indeed not just some, but most.
> 
> I'd like to call on the SAA to advise the IETF Chair that the quoted
> blanket smear on the character of the participants in the prior threads
> is out of line, and an apology is owed to the IETF community, along with
> an expectation that this sort of slander will not be repeated.
> 
> -- 
> 	Viktor.
>

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