Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05.txt> (Internationalized Email Addresses in X.509 certificates) to Proposed Standard
John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com> Mon, 23 January 2017 23:10 UTC
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Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2017 18:10:28 -0500
From: John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com>
To: Patrik Fältström <paf@frobbit.se>, Alexey Melnikov <alexey.melnikov@isode.com>
Subject: Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05.txt> (Internationalized Email Addresses in X.509 certificates) to Proposed Standard
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--On Monday, January 23, 2017 22:50 +0100 Patrik Fältström <paf@frobbit.se> wrote: >... > OLD: > > In setup for SmtpUtf8Mailbox, the email address local-part > MUST be converted to UTF-8 if it is not already. > > NEW: > > In setup for SmtpUtf8Mailbox, the email address local-part > MUST be converted to UTF-8 if it is not already. The > local-part MUST NOT be transformed in any way, for example by > doing case folding or normalization of any kind. That reinvents the same apparent contradiction I was concerned about. RFC 6530 and 6531 require (there is a MUST) in Section 1.1 of 6531 and maybe elsewhere) that all relevant strings, including Mailboxes, be in UTF-8 (noting that an all-ASCII string with ASCII encoded in the usual octet form with a leading zero bit followed by (seven-bit) ASCII is a string encoded in UTF-8. So there is no such thing as a SMTPUTF8-valid local-part that is not in UTF-8 and no conversion can possibly be needed. If it is needed, then this I-D is allowing local-part strings that do not conform to 6530/6531 (or 5321 for that matter). If that were the intent, a _lot_ more discussion is needed, if only because I believe there are CCSs floating around that do not have obvious and unique transformations to Unicode (which would be a necessary step to get them to [Unicode in] UTF-8). Then you say "MUST NOT be transformed in any way", which is correct, but "conversion to UTF-8", required by the previous sentence, is "transformed in [some] way". One way out of this would be to say NEW2: In setup for SmtpUtf8Mailbox, the email address local-part MUST conform to the requirements of RFC 6530 and 6531, including already being a string in UTF-8 form. In particular, the local-part MUST NOT be transformed in any way, such as by doing case folding or normalization of any kind. That accomplishes two things: (i) It avoids the apparent contradiction. (ii) It puts the responsibility for the restriction on the SMTPUTF8 specs and makes it clear that this I-D is just carrying those restrictions over. IMO, the less this spec appears to be imposing its own restrictions, the better off we will all be. That is especially important if there is even the vaguest of chances that we might eventually decide that unnormalized strings, or strings with no restrictions on the code points (other than those ASCII-repertoire characters prohibited by RFC 5321), are a terrible idea and either deprecate or recommend against their use. If this part of this document is strictly dependent on 6531 and its successors, we avoid the need to untangle it to reflect that change and the risk of having it be contradictory to the mail spec. best, john
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John C Klensin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Alexey Melnikov
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Patrik Fältström
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John C Klensin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Patrik Fältström
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John C Klensin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Patrik Fältström
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John C Klensin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John R Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John C Klensin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John C Klensin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Wei Chuang
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Wei Chuang
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Diversity, writing systems, identifiers, and prot… John C Klensin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Wei Chuang
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John C Klensin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Wei Chuang
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Wei Chuang
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Russ Housley
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Russ Housley
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Russ Housley
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Russ Housley
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Russ Housley
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Russ Housley
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… John R. Levine
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Wei Chuang
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Stephen Farrell
- RE: [Spasm] Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addr… Jim Schaad
- RE: [Spasm] Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addr… John C Klensin
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Wei Chuang
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Russ Housley
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addresses-05… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Spasm] Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addr… Wei Chuang
- Re: [Spasm] Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addr… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: [Spasm] Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addr… Wei Chuang
- Re: [Spasm] Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addr… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: [Spasm] Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addr… tom p.
- Re: [Spasm] Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addr… Wei Chuang
- Re: [Spasm] Last Call: <draft-ietf-lamps-eai-addr… Wei Chuang