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RE: Accurate history [Re: "professional" in an IETF context]

Vasilenko Eduard <vasilenko.eduard@huawei.com> Thu, 04 November 2021 16:23 UTC

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From: Vasilenko Eduard <vasilenko.eduard@huawei.com>
To: "gjshep@gmail.com" <gjshep@gmail.com>, Masataka Ohta <mohta@necom830.hpcl.titech.ac.jp>
CC: IETF discussion list <ietf@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: Accurate history [Re: "professional" in an IETF context]
Thread-Topic: Accurate history [Re: "professional" in an IETF context]
Thread-Index: AQHX0CVovVGa7jvYXUCxunxuZ8u5Aqvxc5hQgAHV/ACAAASrAIAAQG4A
Date: Thu, 04 Nov 2021 16:23:03 +0000
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References: <8F4B97EA-665F-4A59-B99D-791B4AB9F2F7@yahoo.co.uk> <746C1453-FFB0-46E5-ABF2-8630DC23B959@network-heretics.com> <c3e9fe1b-8e48-a364-9e25-4084dac70889@meetinghouse.net> <3a6bf8ad-5492-0942-a451-6317e8a93705@network-heretics.com> <3e685576-a230-a7c4-f371-d66a55aa820d@necom830.hpcl.titech.ac.jp> <7a087707-499f-e3bf-8701-1a58930a8a22@meetinghouse.net> <4ec32d7a-a17b-635b-91bc-4152313d6800@necom830.hpcl.titech.ac.jp> <885e62bf-7d6a-4501-a48a-e7c2cbf20382@joelhalpern.com> <e59adb61-a55c-7f5f-a60a-40bf186c139d@necom830.hpcl.titech.ac.jp> <CAC8QAceMSrfkqGTYcMNr3JargO3gxJqTaEyf02LGHd-KVeUDHw@mail.gmail.com> <6286da3e-2beb-9556-089a-2e1951573b1e@gmail.com> <59c80b60-438f-b10f-ad61-ba839f6e4f95@necom830.hpcl.titech.ac.jp> <e834916e85ea47ef94fce07c23928d2b@huawei.com> <37b299c8-e821-07e5-6240-68fb9d1ca137@gmail.com> <23b450fb11eb4a51bb4ee837b5c52657@huawei.com> <a805b50d-3ccd-dd2a-4931-6c6dc9a8ede3@necom830.hpcl.titech.ac.jp> <CABFReBoMue+WU3YEzs4Qz4RCB=3=Q2p_tCdy=wiY0Ld9XcHCfw@mail.gmail.com>
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If the reasoning is non-technical (political or business)
then running code is about “how many people are behind it”.
Make sense for “consensus” that is the product of political debates.
Hence, “running code” is not trolling – it is the search for additional arguments in the political debates.

The running code should be massively deployed to prove anything in Architecture.
Eduard
From: ietf [mailto:ietf-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Greg Shepherd
Sent: Thursday, November 4, 2021 6:27 PM
To: Masataka Ohta <mohta@necom830.hpcl.titech.ac.jp>
Cc: IETF discussion list <ietf@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: Accurate history [Re: "professional" in an IETF context]

Existence of running code for some specification means
not that the specification is good but that we can
operate and evaluate the specification to judge whether
it is good or not.

                                                Masataka Ohta

This, surprisingly, can't be said enough. I've repeatedly heard the argument that someone's running code is verification that the idea is sound, and therefore the solution should be adopted. And I can rarely tell if they are simply lacking any sense of architecture or if they are just trolling the group to push their work. Either way, it's exhausting.

- Shep

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