Why we have situated software (Re: A sad farewell)
Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org> Fri, 06 November 2020 19:31 UTC
Return-Path: <cabo@tzi.org>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD1A03A0CC3 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 6 Nov 2020 11:31:57 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.897
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1JHAJPqrUvls for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 6 Nov 2020 11:31:55 -0800 (PST)
Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D950B3A0D4F for <ietf@ietf.org>; Fri, 6 Nov 2020 11:31:51 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p548dcc60.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.141.204.96]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4CSVrP1MChzyfd; Fri, 6 Nov 2020 20:31:49 +0100 (CET)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\))
Subject: Why we have situated software (Re: A sad farewell)
From: Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>
In-Reply-To: <CE764E62-AC69-4339-B4ED-A0D0044E995E@strayalpha.com>
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2020 20:31:48 +0100
Cc: Larry Masinter <LMM@acm.org>, IETF <ietf@ietf.org>, Pete Resnick <resnick@episteme.net>
X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 626383908.684106-75bb5434ecea12d4ebcf677201eca0c2
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <AE66892A-BE7A-4B68-81BC-8478AFB074A5@tzi.org>
References: <b0ca070f-dd1f-1b8d-940c-7e4c57ea8393@cisco.com> <5fa3ffbe.1c69fb81.a621e.78ba@mx.google.com> <MN2PR15MB3103C6573396210E2CA7274D97EE0@MN2PR15MB3103.namprd15.prod.outlook.com> <E971F6B0-EFF1-4E1D-8CCB-80FA7FEB722D@gmail.com> <20201105174127.GF1750809@mit.edu> <6f1fcd3a-c3cf-a9a7-7aaf-af327d337f43@mnt.se> <CAKq15vcBBGhwAd76LEQDhEa+e1XcTr2HGnmJw9J9y9znbjFMAw@mail.gmail.com> <174AC0A1-77B5-4B6B-AD9D-7C9FB6023BC1@episteme.net> <CAKq15vc947QrG0KgTdP2kiLpE_8YXbEWMZfyFqaGRdJ4me-Mxg@mail.gmail.com> <CE739672-72C4-44B7-821A-99AE400F574C@akamai.com> <CAKq15vdEVfk4ST+WEk06hdgVxMtUU=GKwZwTjtoUSxvEouHRfg@mail.gmail.com> <6FCC5D7B-2EDC-4191-AA0F-BE91211B9B07@akamai.com> <CAKq15vcRAu8VrDmZ-44z3vy8r=1Rx-AA0Xwsg84JFRjpX+=Ypg@mail.gmail.com> <CE764E62-AC69-4339-B4ED-A0D0044E995E@strayalpha.com>
To: Joseph Touch <touch@strayalpha.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4)
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/WREenbztwQROIqVzYFmhoNrMNP4>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2020 19:32:03 -0000
On 2020-11-06, at 02:47, Joseph Touch <touch@strayalpha.com> wrote: > > I don’t think Git can itself track Word diffs, e.g. If requiring Git manage edits is a criteria, you’ve walled the solution in (and it’s standing in 1970). Whoa. It’s Word that is trying to live that 1970’s dream, WYSIWYG. It has taken a long time for the community to realize that this approach is not productive for collaboration on technical documents. That’s why today we use git (which now is the gold standard for collaborative development) and markdown (or some other humane markup language). (I usually collaborate on slides with Keynote. I fully understand the pull that this kind of tools exerts [in particular if done right], and they are great for one-off stuff like slides. But that is a kind of tool that is less central to the core business of the IETF.) [Why do I react so strongly here? I have edited one RFC using Word, RFC 3095, with a herd of 15 co-authors. Never, never, never again.] Grüße, Carsten
- Re: A sad farewell Russ Housley
- A sad farewell Henrik Levkowetz
- Re: A sad farewell Ladislav Lhotka
- Re: A sad farewell Alissa Cooper
- RE: A sad farewell Ron Bonica
- Re: A sad farewell Barry Leiba
- Re: A sad farewell Suresh Krishnan
- Re: A sad farewell Eric Vyncke (evyncke)
- Re: A sad farewell Toerless Eckert
- Re: A sad farewell Mirja Kuehlewind
- Re: A sad farewell Keith Moore
- Re: A sad farewell JORDI PALET MARTINEZ
- Re: A sad farewell Stephen Farrell
- Re: A sad farewell Daniel Migault
- Re: A sad farewell S Moonesamy
- Re: A sad farewell Charlie Perkins
- Re: A sad farewell Jay Daley
- Re: A sad farewell Loa Andersson
- Re: A sad farewell Soininen, Jonne (Nokia - FI/Espoo)
- Re: A sad farewell Dirk Kutscher
- Re: A sad farewell Stephane Bortzmeyer
- Re: A sad farewell Carsten Bormann
- Re: A sad farewell Lloyd W
- Re: A sad farewell Leif Johansson
- Re: A sad farewell Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: A sad farewell Julian Reschke
- Re: A sad farewell Ralph Droms
- Re: A sad farewell Brian E Carpenter
- Re: A sad farewell Benoit Claise
- Re: A sad farewell Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: A sad farewell Keith Moore
- Re: A sad farewell Joseph Touch
- Re: A sad farewell Jim Fenton
- Re: A sad farewell Alia Atlas
- RE: A sad farewell Valery Smyslov
- WAIT. Take a moment. Re: A sad farewell Eliot Lear
- Re: WAIT. Take a moment. Re: A sad farewell Alexander Pelov
- Re: WAIT. Take a moment. Re: A sad farewell Carsten Bormann
- Re: WAIT. Take a moment. Re: A sad farewell Henrik Levkowetz
- Re: A sad farewell Henrik Levkowetz
- Re: A sad farewell Mehmet Ersue
- RE: A sad farewell Eric Gray
- Re: A sad farewell Stewart Bryant
- Re: A sad farewell Theodore Y. Ts'o
- Re: A sad farewell Leif Johansson
- Re: A sad farewell Larry Masinter
- Re: A sad farewell Leif Johansson
- Re: A sad farewell Pete Resnick
- Re: A sad farewell Carsten Bormann
- Re: A sad farewell Joe Touch
- Re: A sad farewell Joel M. Halpern
- Re: A sad farewell Larry Masinter
- Re: A sad farewell Jay Daley
- Re: A sad farewell Joseph Touch
- Re: A sad farewell Larry Masinter
- Re: A sad farewell Brian E Carpenter
- Re: A sad farewell Jay Daley
- Re: A sad farewell Salz, Rich
- Re: A sad farewell Larry Masinter
- Re: A sad farewell Salz, Rich
- Re: A sad farewell Salz, Rich
- Re: A sad farewell Larry Masinter
- Re: A sad farewell Joseph Touch
- Re: A sad farewell Keith Moore
- Re: A sad farewell Masataka Ohta
- Re: A sad farewell Joseph Touch
- Re: A sad farewell Lloyd W
- Re: A sad farewell Leif Johansson
- discussion of tools and requirements Re: A sad fa… Amelia Andersdotter
- Re: A sad farewell Fernando Gont
- Re: A sad farewell Livingood, Jason
- Re: A sad farewell Livingood, Jason
- RE: A sad farewell Adrian Farrel
- Re: A sad farewell Livingood, Jason
- Re: A sad farewell Fernando Gont
- Re: A sad farewell Alissa Cooper
- Re: A sad farewell Salz, Rich
- Document diffs... Re: A sad farewell Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: Document diffs... Re: A sad farewell Joseph Touch
- Re: Document diffs... Re: A sad farewell Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: A sad farewell tom petch
- Re: Document diffs... Re: A sad farewell Joseph Touch
- Re: A sad farewell Russ Housley
- Why we have situated software (Re: A sad farewell) Carsten Bormann
- Re: Why we have situated software (Re: A sad fare… Pete Resnick
- Why we have situated software (Re: A sad farewell) Carsten Bormann
- Re: Document diffs... Re: A sad farewell Carsten Bormann
- Re: A sad farewell Donald Eastlake
- and... text for the win Michael Richardson
- Re: and... text for the win John Levine
- Re: and... text for the win Carsten Bormann
- Re: and... text for the win Julian Reschke
- Re: and... text for the win Christian Huitema
- Re: and... text for the win Eric Vyncke (evyncke)
- Re: and... text for the win Carsten Bormann
- Re: and... text for the win Marc Petit-Huguenin
- Re: and... text for the win Charlie Perkins
- Re: A sad farewell Masataka Ohta
- What is going wrong? Was: A sad farewell Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: What is going wrong? Was: A sad farewell Masataka Ohta