Re: Last Call: Change the status of ADSP (RFC 5617) to Historic

Barry Leiba <barryleiba@computer.org> Wed, 20 November 2013 17:13 UTC

Return-Path: <barryleiba.mailing.lists@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6A921AE49A for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 20 Nov 2013 09:13:13 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.278
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.278 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CZnmj5U7HEWw for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 20 Nov 2013 09:13:12 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-vb0-x234.google.com (mail-vb0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c02::234]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47E501AE498 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 20 Nov 2013 09:13:12 -0800 (PST)
Received: by mail-vb0-f52.google.com with SMTP id f13so35951vbg.11 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 20 Nov 2013 09:13:05 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject :from:to:content-type; bh=A0iOXIbnzBtW7fbxOy3DwXFEXdyJs4OcVvNno46Sv/k=; b=IRePZo52ZKPpSG+A/KfKtAZLw9CRsSgzitLdzAmPz0SfJgbZfWqgdyaJ4qO8hm6u23 o8kV5Il02eO6+uM2Hf7cD5z7w10ety888wth1WER9sxO4xgtyu47WaByu1cN2kgW3ZLN 3TiOe8Vj5c8YkNESO8FJqP8NmYmXnzMzUCL+rN2W8/iu33azRDHdjFzV8H9/ZhEx3s9K V2/kSbSE52jJxXYRC18+Gp/saqWQYMlnp76Omp11FkCth+iK+BbZdqyMWBw6na62aa3T OxWC9l9yLQohqNSRMhMB9zRiSljZROrEcrPpNMRU49Mg9sSPUk7D/RnVOzUmNsmqDJpE yBuA==
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Received: by 10.220.159.4 with SMTP id h4mr1247558vcx.1.1384967585705; Wed, 20 Nov 2013 09:13:05 -0800 (PST)
Sender: barryleiba.mailing.lists@gmail.com
Received: by 10.58.170.71 with HTTP; Wed, 20 Nov 2013 09:13:05 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <524D846A.6030905@tana.it>
References: <20131002145238.78084.qmail@joyce.lan> <524D846A.6030905@tana.it>
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2013 12:13:05 -0500
X-Google-Sender-Auth: PFJoxF0-0ZLNcvfPZKVBVi6yWLM
Message-ID: <CAC4RtVBb9FVtmjK4X5hCQpMorHnjmyJLU1sYbNh==iBh8SqztQ@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Last Call: Change the status of ADSP (RFC 5617) to Historic
From: Barry Leiba <barryleiba@computer.org>
To: IETF discussion list <ietf@ietf.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2013 17:13:13 -0000

Closing the loop on this:

I see very strong and very broad agreement with taking this action:
reclassifying ADSP (RFC 5617) as Historic.

I see two objections:

One, by Hector, is that ADSP does have a lot of deployment: there's
code out there, both open source and commercial, that implements it,
and there are enough publications of ADSP records to demonstrate that
it's in use.

Another, by John Klensin and Alessandro, that making ADSP historic is
fine, but that it should be done with a document that explains the
deployment situation and explains why the reclassification is
appropriate despite that.  Alessandro also wants us to consider fixing
ADSP instead.

Hector is certainly correct that code was quickly written and shipped
to implement ADSP, so there is plenty of deployed code.  The
contention, though, is that ADSP is not providing the benefits it was
intended to, and is, in fact, actually causing harm due to misuse and
misconfiguration.  Those factors make it important for us to
officially recommend that it NOT be used -- hence the
reclassification.  I have asked for, and not seen, any real data
showing benefits from ADSP.

John has a reasonable point about writing up an explanation, and we
have had volunteers to do so.  The IESG will consider whether that is
a better approach than just changing the RFC's metadata.  As to
Alessandro's point about fixing ADSP, it's clear that there is no
community interest in doing that in a way that remains compatible with
RFC 5617's specification.

I see, therefore, clear consensus to make this status change, either
through a simple metadata change or accompanied by an explanatory
document.  The IESG will decide how to proceed.

Barry, Applications AD