Re: Off-topic: making WebRTC work in practice (Re: a brief pondering)

Peter Saint-Andre <stpeter@mozilla.com> Mon, 06 April 2020 16:06 UTC

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Subject: Re: Off-topic: making WebRTC work in practice (Re: a brief pondering)
To: Eric Rescorla <ekr@rtfm.com>, Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>
Cc: Phillip Hallam-Baker <phill@hallambaker.com>, IETF Discussion Mailing List <ietf@ietf.org>
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From: Peter Saint-Andre <stpeter@mozilla.com>
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Date: Mon, 06 Apr 2020 10:06:48 -0600
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On 4/6/20 9:48 AM, Eric Rescorla wrote:
> 
> 
> On Mon, Apr 6, 2020 at 8:28 AM Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca
> <mailto:mcr%2Bietf@sandelman.ca>> wrote:
> 
> 
>     Phillip Hallam-Baker <phill@hallambaker.com
>     <mailto:phill@hallambaker.com>> wrote:
>         > We need an open standard for such a client. Because that is
>     the only way
>         > users can be assured the client they are downloading hasn't
>     got a backdoor.
>         > It isn't a perfect guarantee but it is better than the
>     situation I have now
>         > where my messaging provider reconfigures its app every ten
>     days or so.
>         > Being forced to install code updates from a single source is a
>     security
>         > risk in itself. And don't tell me that frequent updates are
>     necessary for
>         > security, if the code is so buggy it has to have an urgent
>     security patch
>         > more than once a month, you are doing it wrong.
> 
>     This.
> 
>     Lots of people have explained why XMPP sucks, but I prefer the suck
>     I know
>     and foster some competition without a fork-lift upgrade, to the
>     single source
>     of code (no matter how "open" source it is).
> 
>     I don't think that the IETF is going to get anywhere with
>     standardized video
>     conferencing.
>     I don't think W3C will either (I think they have less of a chance
>     actually).
> 
>     WebRTC is a good start, and I'm happier with javascript I have to
>     download
>     and trust than native code I have to download.
> 
>     Having said this, eating our own dogfood is really important.
>     IPv6, webrtc, QUIC, TLS1.3.
> 
>     I understand from this thread that webrtc solutions can *not* send p2p
>     streams between end points?  
> 
> 
> No, they can. However, many WebRTC-based conferencing systems still
> use a centralized topology, for a variety of reasons.

Among other things, a selective forwarding unit is needed in order to
scale a videoconference beyond 3-4 participants (because few devices can
decode more video streams than that at once).

Peter