Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev
Michael StJohns <msj@nthpermutation.com> Tue, 28 May 2019 20:35 UTC
Return-Path: <msj@nthpermutation.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E012120047 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 28 May 2019 13:35:46 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.898
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=nthpermutation-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kXTSSH0ABFKs for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 28 May 2019 13:35:44 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-vs1-xe2b.google.com (mail-vs1-xe2b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e2b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 538ED120104 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Tue, 28 May 2019 13:35:44 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-vs1-xe2b.google.com with SMTP id q64so216372vsd.1 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Tue, 28 May 2019 13:35:44 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=nthpermutation-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=subject:to:references:cc:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding:content-language; bh=r36US7yj6n7TCCy4O5OcDs6ftDJE8JZliltZ58MFGV4=; b=K2bS2vrTtLobTxmBuSjDCAGCLO+X+H9sOYIb4PuSq/uBeJGDCgFT2ey+/77sbfsNKB zBVM2jNyYqqZrCEoX09geVM8G7a+3vwVFJVPzTqAveniVFMoFK3hUhRENeUMSizjQVPA prw9E4UkpHqx2MH0nRZp/G98kLy7NTefMhYG1/eKzrz5cayEx+ofQYmbLpFro4U2geDP 0LQz4CeF2LFpg3w1qsgp7uXdjwcIvT63VlUukI1i1uF4zavpErEHrUk3Fxf4oEAJBUce Nz/RmBdpC3yIDiA7SpSJell0sKgQzgCOJ4S42ji9N0KUuDFu+bRXGBfliOPs7TGmy8RN vbBQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:cc:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding :content-language; bh=r36US7yj6n7TCCy4O5OcDs6ftDJE8JZliltZ58MFGV4=; b=ffqjY3M6i+FaeS2trns7b64ANqvVtoYW8oCDImov/WsqtVnkzumLPr8j/gcISkI/zx fNsfFDPMFe54pVHc+N/OrAhwpHZXN9eQ/M5Mf99UuGs/ehUKvy/Get46K5Iw+GVEpj1O WUlCTMtolTeH8A1yf3InQ+UQh8QtoRT+eHdT8exUbq/C/Srvz8iVhC3ZPZq3bmPp8OEr yxPw7TsjJAoiM9TeYiyOIHM2mbls3eoAbq4gofgJTtR69SKu4Or2RAlaclFwIqw2+vPR Grr/mRQV/MwQz/3LBVIFuBIuC/HvzBtlmQvcPCzc1ydHxi3gPf5Ox0KOg05tY1xsAota wJvw==
X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVlhS61ClUtJ9ko6eb6zkuyH595oypYjS5xGVTGbF2ExjQxb6vl zMNf0KpRDOw8YscX5C1nFX5mzuW2Uhg=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyjLGq97tXucOrMt3Kwgs1Mor287FEIdCozNXvO+WpXmDkQW1oLYLG/1zMWoZH9CzdTKalLSA==
X-Received: by 2002:a67:b30b:: with SMTP id a11mr69652151vsm.86.1559075743013; Tue, 28 May 2019 13:35:43 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ?IPv6:2601:152:4400:437c:8de:83dd:6074:2a6f? ([2601:152:4400:437c:8de:83dd:6074:2a6f]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c3sm3302285vso.2.2019.05.28.13.35.42 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 28 May 2019 13:35:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev
To: eligibility-discuss@ietf.org
References: <6.2.5.6.2.20190509041736.0d6d4548@elandsys.com> <f5834466-8f40-42bd-82d8-4dcb7d418859@www.fastmail.com> <6.2.5.6.2.20190509105617.0c08ef60@elandnews.com> <e854adaf-1ead-41d0-95bf-df56cb5a5914@www.fastmail.com> <6.2.5.6.2.20190514234822.0bc461f0@elandnews.com> <15BCE05FEA1EEA6AD0E7E5BD@PSB> <6.2.5.6.2.20190516103829.11f9fb18@elandnews.com> <E85C84CF-DB0B-410E-A0B2-A7C7E705E469@kaloom.com> <6.2.5.6.2.20190518141450.1163e590@elandnews.com> <82E6BD6B-41F4-4827-8E18-3FF63511DFEA@gmail.com> <EC966FE1-C1EE-453F-A66E-61B007293792@episteme.net> <CDAD735A89911ADC5F0F2DFA@JcK-HP5.jck.com> <B5AF3E16-1C6E-4EFE-8207-8D9D90025858@episteme.net> <3415C5F0030817714DA1891B@PSB>
Cc: ietf@ietf.org
From: Michael StJohns <msj@nthpermutation.com>
Message-ID: <42cda6df-4c55-f729-b4ec-fc1d6237ace3@nthpermutation.com>
Date: Tue, 28 May 2019 16:35:41 -0400
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.7.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <3415C5F0030817714DA1891B@PSB>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Content-Language: en-US
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/i9rNCH_EkiKOmtLn1BO_QQRg6HA>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 28 May 2019 20:35:46 -0000
Suggestion that I should have made 100 message ago: This seems to be a "recall" proposal against the current recall process. So - how about we see if there are 20 "eligible" people that are willing to sponsor this? And if not, can we be done with it now? AFAICT there are about 10 or so folk that have offered more than a single comment, but again AFAICT I didn't really see anyone expressing more than tepid interest in spending time on this. FWIW, I think that it's probably OK to continue to have the "how much influence should a remote-only participant have over the IETF process discussion" but I also think that resolving that question before getting down into the "how many deck chairs on the titanic" type discussions for the recall process may be a much more productive approach that what I'm currently seeing. And please - can it be time to move it off the IETF mailing list? Later, Mike PS - like it or not, meeting fees provide a substantial amount of the money for the general IETF budget specifically including standards publication. If you are arguing for actions that reduce or tend to reduce or have the potential to limit the intake of funds from that model, I suggest you also come up with a more than handwaving proposal for how to replace those funds or explain which functions supported by the IETF we're going to eliminate to cover such shortfall.
- AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Alissa Cooper
- RE: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Adrian Farrel
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Aaron Falk
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Loganaden Velvindron
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev John C Klensin
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Brian E Carpenter
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev John C Klensin
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Benjamin Kaduk
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Spencer Dawkins at IETF
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev John C Klensin
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Alissa Cooper
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Alissa Cooper
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Michael StJohns
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Spencer Dawkins at IETF
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Michael StJohns
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Benjamin Kaduk
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Scott O. Bradner
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev John C Klensin
- Gaming email [was: AD Sponsorship of draft-moones… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Gaming email [was: AD Sponsorship of draft-mo… Stephen Farrell
- Re: Gaming email [was: AD Sponsorship of draft-mo… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Spencer Dawkins at IETF
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Salz, Rich
- Recall petitions as an attack vector (was: Re: AD… John C Klensin
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Eric Rescorla
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Michael StJohns
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Keith Moore
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Salz, Rich
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Kathleen Moriarty
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Salz, Rich
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Nico Williams
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Andrew G. Malis
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Nico Williams
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Nico Williams
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Dave Taht
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Eric Rescorla
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Eliot Lear
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Salz, Rich
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Salz, Rich
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Joel M. Halpern
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Nico Williams
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Brian E Carpenter
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Keith Moore
- RE: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Adrian Farrel
- RE: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Adrian Farrel
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Stewart Bryant
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Andrew G. Malis
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Nico Williams
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Stewart Bryant
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Nico Williams
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Stewart Bryant
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Nico Williams
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev John C Klensin
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Nico Williams
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Michael StJohns
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev John C Klensin
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Benjamin Kaduk
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Andrew G. Malis
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Andrew Sullivan
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Alissa Cooper
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Alissa Cooper
- RE: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Adrian Farrel
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Michael StJohns
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev 'Andrew Sullivan'
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- RE: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Adrian Farrel
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Suresh Krishnan
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Eric Rescorla
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Spencer Dawkins at IETF
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Eric Rescorla
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Brian E Carpenter
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev John C Klensin
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Suresh Krishnan
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Stephen Farrell
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev John C Klensin
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev S Moonesamy
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Pete Resnick
- Re: AD Sponsorship of draft-moonesamy-recall-rev Theodore Ts'o
- Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft… John C Klensin
- Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft… Loganaden Velvindron
- Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft… Iyedi Goma
- Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft… John C Klensin
- Remote participant fees (was : Re: [Eligibility-d… John C Klensin
- Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft… Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft… Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft… Keith Moore
- Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft… Pete Resnick
- Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft… John C Klensin
- Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft… Abdussalam Baryun
- Re: [Eligibility-discuss] AD Sponsorship of draft… Michael StJohns
- ietf meeting fees Keith Moore
- Re: ietf meeting fees Michael StJohns
- Re: ietf meeting fees Brian E Carpenter
- Re: ietf meeting fees Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: ietf meeting fees Bob Hinden
- Re: ietf meeting fees Michael Richardson
- Re: ietf meeting fees John C Klensin
- Re: ietf meeting fees Andrew Sullivan
- Re: ietf meeting fees Livingood, Jason
- Re: ietf meeting fees George Michaelson
- Re: ietf meeting fees Abdussalam Baryun