Re: Getting the latest version of an RFC specification

Yoav Nir <ynir.ietf@gmail.com> Wed, 29 March 2017 12:19 UTC

Return-Path: <ynir.ietf@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E18A129463 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 29 Mar 2017 05:19:51 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.698
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rux6_dZx_3YU for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 29 Mar 2017 05:19:48 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-it0-x233.google.com (mail-it0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8DABC1294CF for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 29 Mar 2017 05:19:45 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-it0-x233.google.com with SMTP id e75so90286881itd.1 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 29 Mar 2017 05:19:45 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=c44dE/pAfsVuft5vuBK8ionfC3QxC+DpdBhV+gIgsXc=; b=nv/lGjNY7aeYcDqt/w/fXwVmEYDnp7SJ7xkYOCb3IKh3URMoXqVRVq7VUPq+RWyy0w bC/VWbB/rPNuyti69L9BQioB+Ke67XBCp9RDE8MtKqZ95wwFoUOmTtpe4c72oea1rXeF ZQ3f3cUsi40zmnCN5CDIBTsAJVEACUjnLtsM5Xl6zV9fHN4BxLyVh91obvpJFbpQm6Np dgZ55FS4t3yVJM4bobczDJWezvonQKQq0r5cZttfUiXrQ5mayhHmSsbTrRG+ax9gLf3N 1uToJsRZLiLj+UoUNlLk6ct65XFhHdJKOCrpVYMe8EtiK0bGH1u/RMHdpy+4awdjrg7b cMtQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=c44dE/pAfsVuft5vuBK8ionfC3QxC+DpdBhV+gIgsXc=; b=YOOQAaRfggCWAn9Xu09Ksia1opq6Lw8pgHPe0HBUxuGQLPFHOiiS2AWEamLW7xvpb5 Zz1LEOvzDyxyitumTUGQxoF5qH59LZsUIEAPnF4bNNi0SOzgroPD1sLoeZLoZ8bP/Qqd ErIZNZSLn9Y648q5FPWFFpgcquCnXeSnd2KsJPjDHJpNiCF8Th8yfWIWY5MkZnEVMr6q vgVbxtu7uZccQrVZHvw31UFhQhZsDxjcECRNNrA0O1t08loTqnyjh2EJT0+5D61tLviz UhU/RtWs+/0CUcBJ/WgO0kHM+gc8rSQTODiP30hjKq5DdQ6NVvjcLqGgGgE/bOypSxC8 JT9A==
X-Gm-Message-State: AFeK/H1HvBAiZzl0YVm7lsoqe626DIghFAJG5eqT+LIzYZsOUnKmrDxg84zspDMOFpSfMw==
X-Received: by 10.36.138.129 with SMTP id v123mr434762itd.108.1490789984713; Wed, 29 Mar 2017 05:19:44 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ?IPv6:2001:67c:1233::7964:d574:44d2:79d8? ([2001:67c:1233:0:7964:d574:44d2:79d8]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g204sm3218099ita.31.2017.03.29.05.19.43 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 29 Mar 2017 05:19:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Yoav Nir <ynir.ietf@gmail.com>
Message-Id: <38BC1BB4-0996-4138-BEE0-58CD4F2B867B@gmail.com>
Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_86FDDE1E-2C7D-4CD0-B9AE-481446B35EC3"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg="pgp-sha512"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\))
Subject: Re: Getting the latest version of an RFC specification
Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2017 07:19:41 -0500
In-Reply-To: <94f81f6a-6a34-6587-a4f7-683586c2f436@dcrocker.net>
Cc: IETF general list <ietf@ietf.org>
To: dcrocker@bbiw.net
References: <94f81f6a-6a34-6587-a4f7-683586c2f436@dcrocker.net>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273)
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/kXZs5UtyDMweYv3JFVHNzd2YioU>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2017 12:19:52 -0000

Hi, Dave

This is definitely doable, although I’d prefer that /latest redirect to the latest rather than display it.

I question how useful it is.  The obsoletes/obsoletedBy relationship is semantically overloaded. Consider the header of RFC 4306:

   Obsoleted by: 5996
   Updated by: 5282
   Request for Comments: 4306
   Obsoletes: 2407, 2408, 2409

RFC 5996 defines IKEv2, same as RFC 4306, but the three RFCs that 4306 obsoletes define the protocol IKEv1, a different protocol.

So what should https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2407/latest <https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2407/latest> return?  2407, because that is the latest RFC defining IKEv1, or 5996 (actually, 7296) because it’s the latest IKE?

The 822 —> 2822 —> 5322 path is one we should follow. I’m not sure the same applies to different versions of a protocol.

Yoav

> On 29 Mar 2017, at 6:51, Dave Crocker <dhc@dcrocker.net> wrote:
> 
> G'day.
> 
> The RFC labeling model is to assign a unique serial number to a static document.  A new version of a spec gets a new serial number. This basic model has the benefit of both simplicity and predictability.
> 
> To this we've added an overlay model, using Obsoletes/ObsoletedBy. This makes it dramatically easier to see that something has been obsoleted and to find its replacement.
> 
> However the seeing and the finding are an essentially manual process. One must go to the online older document, then notice the Obsoleted By tag and then click to follow it.
> 
> Sometimes it would be helpful for the requester to be able to say 'give me the latest' more easily.
> 
> So I'm wondering whether the IETF should consider adding a citation feature for this.
> 
> Something like:
> 
>     https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc822/latest
> 
> would display the contents of:
> 
>     https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5322
> 
> by having the fetching system automatically traversing the Obsoleted By links in RFC 822 and then RFC 2822.
> 
> Some sort of display banner would flag this, to help the user see that they are getting a different version than they cited.
> 
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> d/
> --
> Dave Crocker
> Brandenburg InternetWorking
> bbiw.net
>