Re: If Muslims are blocked by the U.S., should the IETF respond?

Christian de Larrinaga <cdel@firsthand.net> Mon, 30 January 2017 18:26 UTC

Return-Path: <cdel@firsthand.net>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4226E129A6D for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 30 Jan 2017 10:26:13 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.206
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.206 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RDNS_NONE=0.793, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=firsthand.net
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0VYeYE3DiKiD for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 30 Jan 2017 10:26:12 -0800 (PST)
Received: from tranquility.default.cdelarrinaga.uk0.bigv.io (unknown [IPv6:2001:41c8:51:8b8::148]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D862212957A for <ietf@ietf.org>; Mon, 30 Jan 2017 10:26:11 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=firsthand.net; s=tranquility; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:CC:To:MIME-Version:Reply-To:From:Date:Message-ID; bh=AqaEMHY1aInShXvYTJ2DtK8zcX2tkE2iAGHEi5937E0=; b=NnfMP8XJnl2PiUA0Ijbptl1KXWNrvr7A7c/Du8BNXI3KFICAgL/x8q9JDwNNo73M1GvHmweoPABrm8nVPkH628SdccfCMl2bPg1YOd5yasKh2RGD/6fmV1k/8jKEO+4SV0F2pMPJ01gMCB5d49XjaBmXhFkv/Kgq8seEc6RU+oQ=;
Received: from 60.88.155.90.in-addr.arpa ([90.155.88.60] helo=Christians-MacBook-Pro.local) by tranquility.default.cdelarrinaga.uk0.bigv.io with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <cdel@firsthand.net>) id 1cYGeR-00053y-2x; Mon, 30 Jan 2017 18:26:03 +0000
Message-ID: <588F8539.9030500@firsthand.net>
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 2017 18:26:01 +0000
From: Christian de Larrinaga <cdel@firsthand.net>
User-Agent: Postbox 5.0.10 (Macintosh/20170123)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com>
Subject: Re: If Muslims are blocked by the U.S., should the IETF respond?
References: <CAAUuzMQwk5v+3HA+KFrsCZfbNSXFpgBE0XdKfJWHgDss9-VkTw@mail.gmail.com> <CAHw9_iJ78ECZ5x8LsR53KhRFnbhi3gV7n8yzG07e1wbN-SG14Q@mail.gmail.c om> <8f5ef9ac-b62b-863a-0a0e-f5d2b329de09@nostrum.com> <20170129134410.GA14422@gsp.org> <4D233FE8-6E84-446F-A8ED-604E4F7EAB99@piuha.net> <m2lgtseuhu.wl-randy@psg.com> <m28tpsecj0.wl-randy@psg.com> <ddd07b90-60c6-20fb-f972-9036c0c06bbb@gmail.com> <3758f87a-7dcb-c11f-d215-2da15ca8fd1d@comcast.net> <7B341AEB153CEC252C87AE9F@PSB>
In-Reply-To: <7B341AEB153CEC252C87AE9F@PSB>
X-Enigmail-Version: 1.2.3
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/m3Vou3J-O_nwtfjpR_hx0yiC0CY>
Cc: ietf@ietf.org
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17
Precedence: list
Reply-To: cdel@firsthand.net
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 2017 18:26:13 -0000

John
I saw a note from Kathy Brown earlier today

https://www.internetsociety.org/blog/institutional/2017/01/message-internet-society-president-and-ceo-kathy-brown


Christian
> John C Klensin <mailto:john-ietf@jck.com>
> 30 January 2017 at 18:19
> --On Monday, January 30, 2017 12:14 -0500 Michael StJohns
> <mstjohns@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> ...
>> We are associated with two organizations that are, by charter,
>> mostly outward facing: the IAB and the ISOC.  The latter
>> organization is probably the right one to take point on
>> statements of mostly political content related to issues that
>> affect our mission.   I would like to suggest that we (the IAB
>> and IESG and IETF Chair) request the ISOC draft a message
>> along the lines of what the ACM and IACR and others have
>> already written.  This would include such details as the
>> affect on the IETF's meetings and the ISOC's outreach program
>> and would ask them to incorporate suggestions from the IETF
>> community on content (but leaving the wording to ISOC).  I'd
>> also suggest they provide a signature page where IETF
>> community members may endorse the ISOC message.
>
> Concur.  I must say that, even without such formal requests, I
> hope ISOC is working on such a statement and am somewhat
> disappointed to have not seen it already.
>
> To the degree possible without getting into our own version of
> "alternate facts", I think it would be worthwhile to identify,
> not only effects on IETF meetings but potential negative effects
> on the Internet if we can't get our work done in a way that is
> consistent with international consensus.
>
>> I would further suggest that a faster but not perfect note is
>> better than the alternative.
>
> Yes.
>
> best,
>     john
>
>
>
> Randy Bush <mailto:randy@psg.com>
> 30 January 2017 at 10:02
> let me spin jari's point a bit differently.
>
> if the outrageous actions out of washington are less than one a week, i
> for one will be surprised. and i strongly encourage protest, funding
> the aclu, etc etc. [ and i have been pushing back against stateside
> meetings for a looooong time ]
>
> but there will soon be violations of rights and sanity which are not so
> obvious to the general public, but will be in the internet community's
> domain. the internet community will need all the energy and resources
> we can muster to deal with those directly on our turf.
>
> expect years of outrageous fascist hateful acts and plan your resource
> expenditures accordingly.
>
> randy
>

-- 
Christian de Larrinaga  FBCS, CITP,
-------------------------
@ FirstHand
-------------------------
+44 7989 386778
cdel@firsthand.net
-------------------------