Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal draft formatting standards required
Stewart Bryant <stbryant@cisco.com> Fri, 03 July 2009 17:13 UTC
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Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 18:13:18 +0100
From: Stewart Bryant <stbryant@cisco.com>
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To: John Leslie <john@jlc.net>
Subject: Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal draft formatting standards required
References: <C671B2EF.2EB7%stefan@aaa-sec.com> <000a01c9fa9f$cbc996a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4A4BEFDD.6070008@gmail.com> <48E7911F78327A449A9FB9563766728611D572E5@exrad4.ad.rad.co.il> <B1268053-5659-4E0A-85FD-DC72404DFDD3@muada.com> <517bf110907020746q527dda57j1fa402e657f246a5@mail.gmail.com> <4A4CCCD3.7030501@cisco.com> <p06250105c672e4c9a55c@[75.145.176.242]> <70ED21D2-1DF5-49F2-8A85-A425AC015D1E@muada.com> <4A4DE7F6.2050205@cisco.com> <20090703165647.GH15652@verdi>
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John Leslie wrote: > Stewart Bryant <stbryant@cisco.com> wrote: > >> That is an author centric view. It is far more important to take a >> reader centric view. >> > > I must dissent. > > Reader-centric views belong to publishing entities that generate > income (whether by purchase, subscription, or advertising). There have > always been book publishers that generate reader-centric interpretations > of RFCs. > > It's expensive to do so; and such publishing entities are careful to > evaluate the potential market before producing one. > > IETF publications produce _no_ income; so we need to minimize the > expenses. That leaves us concentrating on the author-centric and > editor-centric views. > > I in no way dispute that other presentations can be "better" for the > reader; I only remind folks that we subsidize IETF publications through > our meeting fees, and other avenues are always available to publish > reader-centric versions. > > For one simple example, I know of nothing preventing citations of > self-published "guides" as Informative References in RFCs. > > > Ah. I thought we wrote RFCs so that others could read them and translate the content into some locally meaningful combination of hardware and software. If that is not the case I wonder why we spend our time writing them? My overarching point of course is the style of an RFC should be so as to maximize the probability that the implementation is correct, and that the preference for style should be driven by that need. Stewart
- More liberal draft formatting standards required Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… John C Klensin
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Tim Bray
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… David Morris
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Andrew Sullivan
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Paul Hoffman
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… james woodyatt
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- RE: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Dearlove, Christopher (UK)
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Harald Alvestrand
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Melinda Shore
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… james woodyatt
- RE: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Yaakov Stein
- RE: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Yaakov Stein
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Stefan Santesson
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Theodore Tso
- RE: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Tony Hain
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Donald Eastlake
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Martin Rex
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Stefan Santesson
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Randy Presuhn
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Melinda Shore
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Julian Reschke
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Douglas Otis
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Stefan Santesson
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Henrik Levkowetz
- RE: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Yaakov Stein
- RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal draft … Iljitsch van Beijnum
- RE: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Yaakov Stein
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Doug Ewell
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Julian Reschke
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Tim Bray
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Stewart Bryant
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Ted Hardie
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Marshall Eubanks
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Ole Jacobsen
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Julian Reschke
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Douglas Otis
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Stewart Bryant
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Marshall Eubanks
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Pete Resnick
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… ned+ietf
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Stefan Winter
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Stewart Bryant
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Stewart Bryant
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Martin Rex
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Julian Reschke
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… John Leslie
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Pete Resnick
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Stewart Bryant
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Stewart Bryant
- Two different threads (was: More liberal draft fo… Andrew Sullivan
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Dave CROCKER
- Re: Two different threads - IETF Document Format Joel M. Halpern
- Re: Two different threads - IETF Document Format John Levine
- RE: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Yaakov Stein
- RE: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Yaakov Stein
- Releasing xml2rfc 1.34pre3? Carsten Bormann
- XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different threads … Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Doug Ewell
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Melinda Shore
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- RE: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Dave Nelson
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Carsten Bormann
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Colin Perkins
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Tim Bray
- RE: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Paul Hoffman
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Melinda Shore
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Doug Ewell
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Marc Petit-Huguenin
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Elwyn Davies
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… ned+ietf
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… James M. Polk
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… James M. Polk
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Patrik Fältström
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Colin Perkins
- RE: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Stefan Santesson
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… ned+ietf
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Tim Bray
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Doug Ewell
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Tim Bray
- RE: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Yaakov Stein
- RE: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Yaakov Stein
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Patrik Fältström
- Re: Releasing xml2rfc 1.34pre3? Lars Eggert
- xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, was: R… Lars Eggert
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… james woodyatt
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Bill McQuillan
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Julian Reschke
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Melinda Shore
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Dave Cridland
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Julian Reschke
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Stewart Bryant
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Stewart Bryant
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Julian Reschke
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Shane Kerr
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Julian Reschke
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Lou Berger
- Re: Releasing xml2rfc 1.34pre3? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Livingood, Jason
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Bob Braden
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Eric Rosen
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Paul Hoffman
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Eric Rosen
- Re: Releasing xml2rfc 1.34pre3? Carsten Bormann
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Julian Reschke
- Re: Releasing xml2rfc 1.34pre3? Tony Hansen
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Dave CROCKER
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Bob Braden
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Russ Housley
- Re: XML2RFC must die, and so must everything else John Levine
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Martin Rex
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Martin Rex
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Julian Reschke
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Julian Reschke
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Martin Rex
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Julian Reschke
- Re: [xml2rfc] Releasing xml2rfc 1.34pre3? Julian Reschke
- RE: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Tony Hain
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Tim Bray
- Re: [xml2rfc] Releasing xml2rfc 1.34pre3? Lars Eggert
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… John C Klensin
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… John C Klensin
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- RE: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Wes Beebee (wbeebee)
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Julian Reschke
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Julian Reschke
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Doug Ewell
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Julian Reschke
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Tony Hansen
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Julian Reschke
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… John C Klensin
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Tim Bray
- RE: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Dave Nelson
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Mark Andrews
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Mark Andrews
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Wes Hardaker
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… John C Klensin
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Julian Reschke
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Stefan Winter
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Mark Andrews
- Re: xml2rfc is OK ( was: Re: XML2RFC must die, wa… Julian Reschke
- RE: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Yaakov Stein
- RE: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Dave Nelson
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… John C Klensin
- Re: More liberal draft formatting standards requi… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Russ White
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Dave CROCKER
- RE: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Yaakov Stein
- Re: XML2RFC must die, was: Re: Two different thre… Russ White
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Sabahattin Gucukoglu
- Re: RFC archival format, was: Re: More liberal dr… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: Releasing xml2rfc 1.34pre3? Iljitsch van Beijnum