Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps
Phillip Hallam-Baker <phill@hallambaker.com> Fri, 26 December 2014 20:16 UTC
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Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2014 20:16:48 +0000
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Subject: Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps
From: Phillip Hallam-Baker <phill@hallambaker.com>
To: Dave Crocker <dcrocker@bbiw.net>
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Cc: Paul Hoffman <paul.hoffman@vpnc.org>, IETF Discussion <ietf@ietf.org>
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On Fri, Dec 26, 2014 at 5:25 PM, Dave Crocker <dhc@dcrocker.net> wrote: > On 12/26/2014 8:50 AM, Paul Hoffman wrote: > > Maybe we can take a short hiatus from our relentless cute naming and > call it what it is: UPPER. > > That's reasonable. > > An alternative that is equally un-cute but highlights one of the more > salient aspects of this realm of work: > > End2End (E2E) > > The technologies in this new area all reside in the end systems, rather > than the underlying packet-switching infrastructure. But where do the endpoints lie? The funny thing about the mail system we are using for this conversation is that it is not end-2-end. The application endpoints are mail clients and/or Web browsers. There are multiple transport endpoints, the inbound and outbound MTAs, spam filters, the list serve... When we get into the trust and security issues the endpoints are people and organizations, not machines. I see a division between two types of 'applications' work. One is work defining actual applications. Things like Jabber, Mail, Minion Rush, Chat, etc. In the early days of the Internet, the IETF had 100% of the applications work. Today there are tens of thousands of applications in widespread use. It is clearly beyond the capacity of the IETF to support development of all such protocols even if it tried. The other type of applications work is to provide standardized infrastructure that can be used to build applications. So just like there are standards for screw sizes, pitches, heads, etc. and these are vitally important to people who make cars, boats and airplane engines, there should be standards for applications infrastructure, like how to map an API to a JSON based Web Service.
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Ted Lemon
- IETF areas re-organisation steps Jari Arkko
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Huub van Helvoort
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Robert Sparks
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Dave Crocker
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Paul Hoffman
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Steve Crocker
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Ted Lemon
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Michael Richardson
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Michael Richardson
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Scott Brim
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Ole Jacobsen
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Dave Crocker
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Alia Atlas
- WGs/AD [IETF areas re-organisation steps] Brian E Carpenter
- Re: WGs/AD [IETF areas re-organisation steps] Stephen Farrell
- Re: WGs/AD [IETF areas re-organisation steps] Alia Atlas
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: WGs/AD [IETF areas re-organisation steps] Brian E Carpenter
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Ted Hardie
- Re: WGs/AD [IETF areas re-organisation steps] Jari Arkko
- Re: WGs/AD [IETF areas re-organisation steps] Alia Atlas
- Re: WGs/AD [IETF areas re-organisation steps] Melinda Shore
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Eggert, Lars
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Nico Williams
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Robert Sparks
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Spencer Dawkins at IETF
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Alissa Cooper
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Ted Hardie
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Robert Sparks
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Eggert, Lars
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Jari Arkko
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Dave Crocker
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Brian Trammell
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Mary Barnes
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Dave Crocker
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Ben Campbell
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Benoit Claise
- RE: IETF areas re-organisation steps Larry Masinter
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Yoav Nir
- RE: IETF areas re-organisation steps Larry Masinter
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Kathleen Moriarty
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps joel jaeggli
- RE: IETF areas re-organisation steps Larry Masinter
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Julian Reschke
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps Brian E Carpenter
- Re: IETF areas re-organisation steps t.p.