Re: BCP97bis
"Murray S. Kucherawy" <superuser@gmail.com> Mon, 18 October 2021 14:33 UTC
Return-Path: <superuser@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A474C3A1447 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 18 Oct 2021 07:33:44 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.096
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.096 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id T_4tzTVrExV6 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 18 Oct 2021 07:33:40 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-vk1-xa36.google.com (mail-vk1-xa36.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::a36]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EC4853A1430 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Mon, 18 Oct 2021 07:33:39 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-vk1-xa36.google.com with SMTP id o42so8688263vkf.9 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Mon, 18 Oct 2021 07:33:39 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=e0owh6qpe9mIcAmlR3dqM0VK0KrH/jpaztZQQeqR3kQ=; b=MZyNF7/Sfz6DOx6jextKWcxgc2Bd8I0jpQFxMb/oP0FAPVrGoj4my+2vijTgvoXkE0 um8rLtsbk9zHYdYzjrDDVLWxvHnAxpAPokfOxF8KI3FYnWTqf7e/a4MBb1A4Ui6mDG8E hGfVwJCQ0ZF1CamXOiG08j+XgQgU/emFaFVIOKALNmCXHYLnrlTBqdkFC02/lSyx9kIa h6bkLSMhgURotF1Udu+mvXQm+//jEHDiaMamLQ10O16If6uJ9/35686Uq2+DvKp5HNXR RfvMKdj6LwSZcVEN64RxB9/PxvW+xC1j/YDdm/pMyEZwz2vzjZoG/2w3TPR3imjye00S /mtQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=e0owh6qpe9mIcAmlR3dqM0VK0KrH/jpaztZQQeqR3kQ=; b=VUGDrLm8O+pAFqcf8gSHQ60ipVrz2N8jW9spKwEHbjjryPr2ANKmTUR4ErUaWC1l5Z vavYiLse2cRzVwqa5u/gxo5Y6EhMUxvTuBTQk4/rLDSiC458o9An2G5DPZDGuH7CCYlp WvvHr3TFmHexZSro8x6jZFT7bXoCqbpY65CSuWdhHVWhHpasysUPJPNaxQ/rfpvS4uEA Vy+KZLF5y6v/R2K7pUI6hMXNsch7oygYGQDxGrGANX17vET+IdL69e2mGGZNLuaDBjTF 71SIUj3uJpAIiXGcFjx4dkF9yv0SqqNsVIYzXyWwLIV6g8ixWVWV7zcw+eDVv21AKT81 IEig==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530+fIw7YNOzp3nWzICHPdQTjHF3lr+Y7MLCIo1iISMjMHnroaLv sN7bDJTgU2ewhzTUk+vV+vz5hfprMEhp6g9THtE=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyr6qtRD0L4TqaIrR+5RdpwKlrtTci6ukrLQk6hPnvbUrwyrvBeoHzD0DzSmUwTUUOWwKDXT4V7UQLHoRxqOFY=
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6122:901:: with SMTP id j1mr25381476vka.13.1634567613026; Mon, 18 Oct 2021 07:33:33 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <CAL0qLwbwvs2Cp_urgJ=hzc6yEMGDaz3C0xf6RQXRrB89wAx=Rw@mail.gmail.com> <CAL0qLwavK5dYdmYPVxdMT5rA=jBZv1cEyAsVBEWOD7p9MoZR1g@mail.gmail.com> <CAL0qLwa4ChOsuMkmoP_sAGv3Wn2AcSz1OkijmxZzP+MGvnwviA@mail.gmail.com> <849D7F9E-8AD4-4CE8-A66C-358FB1F2E6AE@tzi.org> <3AC61568-DBDC-4ADB-9935-9C53333AE7E2@akamai.com>
In-Reply-To: <3AC61568-DBDC-4ADB-9935-9C53333AE7E2@akamai.com>
From: "Murray S. Kucherawy" <superuser@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 18 Oct 2021 07:33:21 -0700
Message-ID: <CAL0qLwZvCq7R=WBFsrwf51CKSN8ur0Yj-F=VOHnP=hQD0ooj-A@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: BCP97bis
To: "Salz, Rich" <rsalz@akamai.com>
Cc: Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>, ietf <ietf@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000ef944c05cea16dd8"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/oyVSJB7jJueipHJCdla5yAn1No0>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Oct 2021 14:33:45 -0000
On Mon, Oct 18, 2021 at 7:29 AM Salz, Rich <rsalz@akamai.com> wrote: > > - At a minimum, authors/editors of source documents need to secure > freely available copies of the target documents for use by all anticipated > reviewers during the source document's life cycle, which includes working > group participants, any member of the community that chooses to participate > in Last Call discussions, area review teams, IANA expert reviewers, and > members of the IESG. The mechanism for acquiring access to those documents > is to be be specified in the shepherd writeup. > > > > I understand the desire for everything that is defined by the IETF to be > built on public freely available resources. I think this goes WAY WAY WAY > too far. > > > > Can I buy a copy of a standard and require it to be postal mailed to > everyone serially? > That's not what we're going for. It's not an insistence that everything be built on public, freely available resources. However, reviewers -- from the WG to the IESG and everyone in between -- need to be able to do their reviews while having access to the normative references. So this says that, at a minimum, those resources need to be made available somehow during the document's development, but there's no requirement for that to continue in perpetuity. The IESG has had multiple cases during my time there where we haven't had access to some normative reference, and so we can't do our job. This has added long delays to document processing. That's what we're trying to address here. -MSK
- BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Russ Housley
- Re: BCP97bis Scott Bradner
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis David Farmer
- Re: BCP97bis Brian Carpenter
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Scott Bradner
- Re: BCP97bis Russ Housley
- Re: BCP97bis Salz, Rich
- Re: BCP97bis Michael Richardson
- Re: BCP97bis and Informational-as-Standard Michael Richardson
- RE: BCP97bis Larry Masinter
- Re: BCP97bis Joel M. Halpern
- Re: BCP97bis Michael Richardson
- Re: BCP97bis Brian E Carpenter
- RE: BCP97bis Larry Masinter
- Re: BCP97bis John Levine
- Re: BCP97bis Scott Bradner
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis Carsten Bormann
- Re: BCP97bis Salz, Rich
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis Brian E Carpenter
- Re: BCP97bis Russ Housley
- Re: BCP97bis Carsten Bormann
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis Carsten Bormann
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis Michael Richardson
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Carsten Bormann
- Re: BCP97bis Carsten Bormann
- Re: BCP97bis tom petch
- RE: BCP97bis mohamed.boucadair
- RE: BCP97bis ned+ietf
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- BCP97bis and "freely available" John C Klensin
- RE: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis Salz, Rich
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis Salz, Rich
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Salz, Rich
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Salz, Rich
- RE: BCP97bis mohamed.boucadair
- Re: BCP97bis a process problem tom petch
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Warren Kumari
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Lars Eggert
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Warren Kumari
- Re: BCP97bis Salz, Rich
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" Scott O. Bradner
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" Brian E Carpenter
- Re: BCP97bis John C Klensin
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" Michael Richardson
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" John C Klensin
- BCP written by another AD [was Re: BCP97bis] Brian E Carpenter
- Re: BCP97bis a process problem Brian E Carpenter
- Re: BCP97bis Michael Richardson
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" Sandy Wills
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" Michael StJohns
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" George Michaelson
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" Randy Presuhn
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" George Michaelson
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" Brian E Carpenter
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" Salz, Rich
- Re: BCP97bis a process problem Michael Richardson
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" Michael Richardson
- RE: BCP97bis ned+ietf
- Re: BCP97bis a process problem Brian E Carpenter
- Re: BCP97bis and "freely available" tom petch
- Re: BCP97bis a process problem tom petch
- Re: BCP written by another AD [was Re: BCP97bis] Erik Kline
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: BCP97bis Salz, Rich
- Re: BCP97bis Murray S. Kucherawy