Re: "why I quit writing internet standards"

Wesley Eddy <wes@mti-systems.com> Wed, 16 April 2014 14:01 UTC

Return-Path: <wes@mti-systems.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B9EF1A01B5 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 16 Apr 2014 07:01:44 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.9
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id adV9EaOjZClX for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 16 Apr 2014 07:01:43 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from atl4mhob10.myregisteredsite.com (atl4mhob10.myregisteredsite.com [209.17.115.48]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FE921A01AD for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 16 Apr 2014 07:01:43 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mailpod.hostingplatform.com ([10.30.71.203]) by atl4mhob10.myregisteredsite.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s3GE1cLV003939 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 16 Apr 2014 10:01:38 -0400
Received: (qmail 17517 invoked by uid 0); 16 Apr 2014 14:01:38 -0000
X-TCPREMOTEIP: 107.47.163.91
X-Authenticated-UID: wes@mti-systems.com
Received: from unknown (HELO ?192.168.43.65?) (wes@mti-systems.com@107.47.163.91) by 0 with ESMTPA; 16 Apr 2014 14:01:37 -0000
Message-ID: <534E8D3B.7080705@mti-systems.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2014 10:01:31 -0400
From: Wesley Eddy <wes@mti-systems.com>
Organization: MTI Systems
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Thomas Clausen <ietf@thomasclausen.org>, Spencer Dawkins <spencerdawkins.ietf@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: "why I quit writing internet standards"
References: <CF71721A.180A9%wesley.george@twcable.com> <201404142144.s3ELipR8014504@hobgoblin.ariadne.com> <C16CB48C-9462-4514-B675-D750D4DC9357@piuha.net> <534DB785.7040609@gmail.com> <EF72D31A-8134-42DB-B750-D5C3831869EE@tzi.org> <534DC46C.60703@gmail.com> <8962F23C-1486-4F52-AD58-BE64CFBC3B4A@thomasclausen.org>
In-Reply-To: <8962F23C-1486-4F52-AD58-BE64CFBC3B4A@thomasclausen.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/qHiMNMEbhFXoN3N9KW6taCElzwM
Cc: Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>, "ietf@ietf.org List" <ietf@ietf.org>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2014 14:01:44 -0000

On 4/16/2014 9:31 AM, Thomas Clausen wrote:
> 
> FWIW, my personal belief is that "running code" should be a
> requirement for anything going std. track -- and that a (mandatory)
> period as Experimental prior to go std. track would yield the stable
> spec against which to reasonably build code, and run
> (interoperability) tests, fix bugs, etc. If after (pulling a number
> out my hat here) a year as Experimental there's no running code, then
> that's probably a good indicator, also, as to if this is something
> the IETF should bother doing....
> 


If there's no running code, or pretty concrete plans and commitments
to get there, then there's really no need for an Experimental RFC that
will get a number and last forever.  An I-D that expires in direct
conjunction with the interest and energy in it is just fine.

Experimental RFCs are for things that we're encouraging folks to get
out and play with in multiple implementations, perhaps on the real
Internet or under some specific conditions, but which may have sharp
edges or explode on impact, and need a bit more work to figure out
if we can seriously recommend the world to depend on them as Standards.

-- 
Wes Eddy
MTI Systems