Re: [ippm] AD review of draft-ietf-ippm-initial-registry-11

"MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" <acm@research.att.com> Sun, 08 September 2019 12:42 UTC

Return-Path: <acm@research.att.com>
X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7AA02120018; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 05:42:57 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.6
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mf9eMiScv3-H; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 05:42:52 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com (mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com [67.231.149.140]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C6B8E120074; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 05:42:52 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from pps.filterd (m0049287.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0049287.ppops.net-00191d01. (8.16.0.27/8.16.0.27) with SMTP id x88CYPZM020359; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 08:42:29 -0400
Received: from tlpd255.enaf.dadc.sbc.com (sbcsmtp3.sbc.com [144.160.112.28]) by m0049287.ppops.net-00191d01. with ESMTP id 2uvt8179qx-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Sun, 08 Sep 2019 08:42:29 -0400
Received: from enaf.dadc.sbc.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tlpd255.enaf.dadc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x88CgSfH087891; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 07:42:28 -0500
Received: from zlp30493.vci.att.com (zlp30493.vci.att.com [135.46.181.176]) by tlpd255.enaf.dadc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x88CgP6T087857 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 8 Sep 2019 07:42:25 -0500
Received: from zlp30493.vci.att.com (zlp30493.vci.att.com [127.0.0.1]) by zlp30493.vci.att.com (Service) with ESMTP id 8A2E2400B57D; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 12:42:25 +0000 (GMT)
Received: from clpi183.sldc.sbc.com (unknown [135.41.1.46]) by zlp30493.vci.att.com (Service) with ESMTP id 65411400B57B; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 12:42:25 +0000 (GMT)
Received: from sldc.sbc.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clpi183.sldc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x88CgPap025485; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 07:42:25 -0500
Received: from mail-azure.research.att.com (mail-azure.research.att.com [135.207.255.18]) by clpi183.sldc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x88CgH71024976; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 07:42:18 -0500
Received: from exchange.research.att.com (njbdcas1.research.att.com [135.197.255.61]) by mail-azure.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4696E5987; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 08:41:29 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from njmtexg5.research.att.com ([fe80::b09c:ff13:4487:78b6]) by njbdcas1.research.att.com ([fe80::8c6b:4b77:618f:9a01%11]) with mapi id 14.03.0468.000; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 08:42:13 -0400
From: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" <acm@research.att.com>
To: Mirja Kuehlewind <ietf@kuehlewind.net>, "draft-ietf-ippm-initial-registry.all@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-ippm-initial-registry.all@ietf.org>
CC: IETF IPPM WG <ippm@ietf.org>, Michelle Cotton <michelle.cotton@iana.org>
Thread-Topic: AD review of draft-ietf-ippm-initial-registry-11
Thread-Index: AQHVXO7t1Dc8eia/wEeItN2FmjYM8qcgzyGQ
Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2019 12:42:15 +0000
Message-ID: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CFA0AF4F2B@njmtexg5.research.att.com>
References: <40A0B71C-4857-46F0-9096-6EE289E7404B@kuehlewind.net>
In-Reply-To: <40A0B71C-4857-46F0-9096-6EE289E7404B@kuehlewind.net>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
x-originating-ip: [69.141.203.172]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:, , definitions=2019-09-08_08:, , signatures=0
X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_policy_notspam policy=outbound_policy score=0 priorityscore=1501 malwarescore=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 lowpriorityscore=0 mlxscore=0 impostorscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1906280000 definitions=main-1909080138
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/uSCxwe42WmWh7I0i-o--mSno9HQ>
Subject: Re: [ippm] AD review of draft-ietf-ippm-initial-registry-11
X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group <ippm.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ippm>, <mailto:ippm-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ippm/>
List-Post: <mailto:ippm@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ippm-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm>, <mailto:ippm-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2019 12:42:57 -0000

Hi Maria,

We've started the discussion on Intended Status,
so I'll start with the quicker questions and comments
on initial-registry draft below.

Al 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mirja Kuehlewind [mailto:ietf@kuehlewind.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2019 11:47 AM
> To: draft-ietf-ippm-initial-registry.all@ietf.org
> Cc: IETF IPPM WG <ippm@ietf.org>rg>; Michelle Cotton
> <michelle.cotton@iana.org>
> Subject: AD review of draft-ietf-ippm-initial-registry-11
> 
> Hi authors, hi all,
> 
> We need to discuss at least one bigger question on the intended status
> before we  can move ahead. However, as you can seen I have more
> questions/comments below.
> 
> The bigger status question first:
> The intended status is PS. The shepherd write-up does not provide any
> additional information about why this status is appropriate. I would
> assume that informational is actually more appropriate. I don’t recall out
> of my head if/when this was discussed and I thought I rather ask than
> searching the list archive and minutes… Is this the right status and why?
> And if so, please reflect in the write-up!
> 
> 
> And then a couple more (hopefully) quicker comments/questions:
> 
> - I know this was already reviewed by IANA (Michelle is also cc’ed),
> however, as far as I can see all Administrative Information (Status,
> Requestor, Revision, and Revision Date) and maybe even the ID don’t need
> to be part of the template because IANA will anyway assign them based on
> the instructions given in draft-ietf-ippm-metric-registry. Or did IANA
> explicitly request to also include these parts?
[acm] 
I think Michelle and I were more comfortable that the 
each section/template indicated exactly where IANA assignments
were needed. It's the line between the shared responsibility of Expert 
Review and IANA to create a complete entry in the registry.

> 
> - Then for the Change Controller that should usually be the IESG rather
> than the IETF. Did IANA comment on that?
[acm] 
Yes, this column is something IANA/Michelle asked for, and I think we 
could be convinced that IESG could replace IETF. But to me, 
"Standards Action" is IETF.
 
> 
> - And one minor point: I guess the secY part of the name could already be
> filled out, no? However, I should probably have asked that on review of
> draft-ietf-ippm-metric-registry already but I was actually wondering if
> the decision to include the RFC number and section in the metric name is
> appropriate. Can you maybe lay out what the reasons for this are (and
> maybe also explain in the draft as his might come up again during IESG
> review otherwise)…?
[acm] 
The reason is simple, a draft may specify more than one registry entry,
as -initial-registry does.

I left the secY part general in case of changes during review.
It's very easy to fill this field at the end, when there is no 
possible shuffling of section order that then requires name edits, 
too. 

> 
> 
> Then then on references again:
> 
> - This draft references two obsoleted RFCs (RFC2679 and RFC2680). I assume
> this is an oversight and the references need to be updated?
[acm] 
Yes, I need to use a text editor and globally update to 7679 and 7680,
XMLMind doesn't seem to let me search in the reference fields easily
(when viewing the XML source).

> 
> - Also given you rely heavily on [Trammell-14], I think this needs to be a
> normative reference (and maybe [Strowes] as well?). The more stable
> pointer for [Trammell-14] is actually here:
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-
> 3A__link.springer.com_chapter_10.1007_978-2D3-2D642-2D54999-2D1-
> 5F2&d=DwIFaQ&c=LFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=OfsSu8kTIltVyD1oL72cBw&m=hwJZg-
> IdxQ9507aw2mjEKKOSWIEVnc8nwr7B_QiOyCU&s=HSEAeC_uI-vofX5ZWPSCH-R4Ph8Gu618-
> YtZJ4pTAgE&e=
> But to be honest the split between normative and informational isn’t
> actually very clear to me here…?
> 
> 
> And on the shepherd write-up:
> 
> It’s indicated that not all authors have replied to the IPR question. This
> need to be checked and respectively reflected in the shepherd write-up
> before we can move ahead!
> 
> 
> And some smaller technical questions/nits:
> 
> - Is it correct that T0 in section 4 is defined in both subsections 4.3.5
> and 4.4.2?
> 
> - Why is an URI given (only) in section 6.1.3?
>   Also section 7.1.3 and 8.1.3.: http:\\www.iana.org\ ... <name> -> I
> think this should be: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-
> 3A__www.iana.org_&d=DwIFaQ&c=LFYZ-
> o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=OfsSu8kTIltVyD1oL72cBw&m=hwJZg-
> IdxQ9507aw2mjEKKOSWIEVnc8nwr7B_QiOyCU&s=9PuQd07oTFlEt8tWIDYz4c-
> qFUd4zpyT_7QeckyeAsc&e=<name>/
> 
> 
> Some more editorial comments/nits:
> 
> - I find it actually unnecessary or rather confusing that most (not all)
> sections start with a sentence/paragraph explaining what the section is
> about (e.g. "Additional (Informational) details for this entry”). I would
> think this is sufficiently explained in draft-ietf-ippm-metric-registry
> and does not need to be repeated here (in this already long document).
> Also note that section 8.6 inconsistently doesn’t have any content while
> 10.6. says “None.”.
> 
> - Also these comments in section 7 and 8 are probably supposed to be
> removed:
> " <insert name of the output type, raw or a selected summary statistic>”
> …?
> 
> - I found this in section 10.2.2: "@@@@@ others??”. I guess there is
> something missing? Also in this part, I don’t think SYN and FIN should be
> set at the same time, no? And rather than providing the Kind and Length of
> the TSopt, I would recommend to provide a pointer to the respective RFC.
> 
> 
> And finally one/two/three more general question(s) at the end, that I
> probably should also have asked already on my review for draft-ietf-ippm-
> metric-registry:
> 
> Is it actually intended that basically all the text in this RFC gets
> copied into the registry? And what is expected to be on the URL page then?
> Wouldn’t it be necessary to also define a format for that page in order to
> be of any use?
> 
> 
> Mirja
> 
> 
> 
>