Re: [IPsec] FW: I-D Action:draft-nir-ipsecme-childless-00.txt

Hi Yaron,

Its clear that critical bit refer to the payload, than to its content. Point
well taken.
But i am not able to understand why we can't define "critical" bit for new
CHILDLESS_IKE_AUTH notify/VID payload ?

With Regards,
Raj

On Sat, Jul 4, 2009 at 6:42 PM, Yaron Sheffer <yaronf@checkpoint.com> wrote:

>  Nope. The Critical bit refers to the payload, rather than to its
> contents, and in fact cannot be set for payloads defined in RFC 4306 (such
> as VID and Notify). So you need to define a NEW payload to benefit from it.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>             Yaron
>
>
>   ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Raj Singh [mailto:rsjenwar@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Saturday, July 04, 2009 13:37
> *To:* Yaron Sheffer
> *Cc:* Yoav Nir; ipsec@ietf.org
>
> *Subject:* Re: [IPsec] FW: I-D Action:draft-nir-ipsecme-childless-00.txt
>
>
>
> Hi Yaron,
>
> I agree with you.
> Your suggestion of having "critical" bit set on childless notify/VID
> payload from initiator in IKE_SA_INIT exchange will define the bahavior as
> mentioned below.
>
> If initiator want to childless IKE_AUTH, it will send  CHILDLESS_IKE_AUTH
> notify/VID payload having "critical" flag SET in IKE_SA_INIT request.
>
> 1. It will help responder not to process the IKE_SA_INIT exchange if it
> does not support childless IKE_AUTH.
>
> "The responder MUST reject IKE_SA_INIT exchange if it receives
> CHILDLESS_IKE_AUTH notify/VID payload in IKE_SA_INIT exchange from initiator
> if responder does not support childless IKE_AUTH and in response to the
> IKE_SA_INIT exchange containing CHILDLESS_IKE_AUTH it MUST send
> UNSUPPORTED_CRITICAL_PAYLOAD, the notification data will contain two-octet
> unsupported notify/VID payload type i.e. CHILDLESS_IKE_AUTH."
>
> 2. It will help initiator to not to go ahead with childless IKE_AUTH if
> responder doesn't support it wtithout procesing IKE_SA_INIT response.
>
> With Regards,
> Raj
>
> On Sat, Jul 4, 2009 at 12:16 AM, Yaron Sheffer <yaronf@checkpoint.com>
> wrote:
>
> Hi Raj,
>
>
>
> It sounds like you want a critical payload (RFC 4306, Sec. 2.5), probably a
> payload with no data. In fact the draft could specify both options, the
> current VID and such a payload, and leave it to the Initiator to decide
> which behavior it prefers. Different scenarios might call for different
> behaviors.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>             Yaron
>
>
>   ------------------------------
>
> *From:* ipsec-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ipsec-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf
> Of *Raj Singh
> *Sent:* Friday, July 03, 2009 16:51
> *To:* Yoav Nir
> *Cc:* ipsec@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [IPsec] FW: I-D Action:draft-nir-ipsecme-childless-00.txt
>
>
>
> Hi Yoav,
>
> Mostly the Initiator will decide that it wants to bring UP only IKE SA
> without child SA.
> But currently there is no notify/VID from Initiator to Responder to
> indicate that initiator wants to bring only IKE SA. Even if responder does
> not supports "childless IKE_AUTH", it will process IKE_SA_INIT, involding
> CPU intensive D-H calculations, and send IKE_SA_INIT response without
> "childless VID" payload.
>
> By introducing a notify/VID payload from Initiator that it wants to bring
> UP only IKE SA without child SA wil ease the processing ar Responder side.
> If responder does not support "childless IKE_AUTH", it can send
> INVALID_SYNTAX. Then, Initiator will wait for "Child SA" info to be
> available to bring UP both IKE and child SA, normally as mentioned in RFC
> 4306.
>
> Thanks,
> Raj
>
> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 1:42 AM, Yoav Nir <ynir@checkpoint.com> wrote:
>
> Hi all.
>
> This is the fourth iteration of this draft.  New in this iteration
>  - Another co-author
>  - Changed the name, so that this item is considered in the rechartering
> discussion
>  - Fixed some notation and some discussion based on comments from the list
>
> Yoav
> ________________________________________
> From: i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org [i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org] On
> Behalf Of Internet-Drafts@ietf.org [Internet-Drafts@ietf.org]
> Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 12:15
> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Subject: I-D Action:draft-nir-ipsecme-childless-00.txt
>
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
>
>        Title           : A Childless Initiation of the IKE SA
>        Author(s)       : Y. Nir, et al.
>        Filename        : draft-nir-ipsecme-childless-00.txt
>        Pages           : 7
>        Date            : 2009-07-01
>
> This document describes an extension to the IKEv2 protocol that
> allows an IKE SA to be created and authenticated without generating a
> child SA.
>
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-nir-ipsecme-childless-00.txt
>
> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/
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