Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead
"Bhatia, Manav (Manav)" <manav.bhatia@alcatel-lucent.com> Thu, 12 November 2009 02:01 UTC
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From: "Bhatia, Manav (Manav)" <manav.bhatia@alcatel-lucent.com>
To: Scott C Moonen <smoonen@us.ibm.com>, Jack Kohn <kohn.jack@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 2009 07:32:18 +0530
Thread-Topic: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead
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Cc: "ipsec@ietf.org" <ipsec@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead
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Scott, > From: ipsec-bounces@ietf.org On Behalf Of Scott C Moonen > Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2009 2.37 AM > To: Jack Kohn > Cc: ipsec@ietf.org; ipsec-bounces@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead > > Jack, I'm not sure it's clear yet whether WESP will be widely adopted. > There's disagreement between end-node and middle-node folks as to whether > WESP or heuristics are the best approach for inspection of ESP-NULL traffic. > I think that end-node vendors will be very reluctant to adopt I cant comment on the interest of the end-node vendors, but i can certainly say that this will be of interest to the router vendors. There are currently a lot of applications (routing/signaling for instance) where we use ESP-NULL for integrity protection (confidentiality is not an issue there) and it will be really good if there are ways to deep inspect these packets for proper QoS treatment. > WESP widely until there is broad customer demand for it, and I'm not > sure that this demand will ever materialize. > > This is all my personal opinion, of course. But it seems to me that heuristics > will have to be adopted by competitive middle-node vendors, and > therefore (barring any extensions to WESP that make it attractive > for other reasons) the use of heuristics will probably always be more > widespread and will dampen the demand for WESP. Additionally, There you go: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-montenegro-ipsecme-wesp-extensions-00 > ESP-NULL itself has rather narrow applicability in an environment where > end-to-end encryption is increasingly common, which further limits Most routing, signaling protocols use ESP-NULL (it's a MUST, while support for AH is a MAY) and I can see benefits of moving to WESP from the QoS perspective. I am not saying that we cannot do QoS with ESP, but it just becomes a tad more flexible/easier with WESP. > the cases where there will be an absolute need for WESP. Furthermore, > there will always be valid reasons to use AH (reduced overhead compared to WESP). > > For reasons like these, I believe it's premature to call for deprecation > of AH and even more premature to start preferring WESP to ESP. I agree. > > What status will the WESP RFC have? Experimental, informational, standards track, etc.? Standards Track Cheers, Manav > > > Scott Moonen (smoonen@us.ibm.com) > z/OS Communications Server TCP/IP Development > http://www.linkedin.com/in/smoonen <http://www.linkedin.com/in/smoonen>
- [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Jack Kohn
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Scott C Moonen
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Tero Kivinen
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Bhatia, Manav (Manav)
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Bhatia, Manav (Manav)
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Merike Kaeo
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Bhatia, Manav (Manav)
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Bhatia, Manav (Manav)
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Jack Kohn
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Daniel Migault
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Jack Kohn
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Steven Bellovin
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Bhatia, Manav (Manav)
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Richard Graveman
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Venkatesh Sriram
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Bhatia, Manav (Manav)
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Bhatia, Manav (Manav)
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Steven Bellovin
- [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Tero Kivinen
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Bhatia, Manav (Manav)
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Tero Kivinen
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Bhatia, Manav (Manav)
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Dan McDonald
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Gregory Lebovitz
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Gregory Lebovitz
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Jack Kohn
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Jack Kohn
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Jack Kohn
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Jack Kohn
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Daniel Migault
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Tero Kivinen
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Tero Kivinen
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Jack Kohn
- Re: [IPsec] WESP - Roadmap Ahead Stephen Kent