Re: Objection to draft-ietf-6man-rfc4291bis-07.txt

Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> Thu, 02 March 2017 20:23 UTC

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Subject: Re: Objection to draft-ietf-6man-rfc4291bis-07.txt
To: ipv6@ietf.org
References: <20170223134026.GI5069@gir.theapt.org> <CAKD1Yr3tHm5x29w4L5KtKi7PqDHRxkPr6i9mJMtHLaPc2eM2GQ@mail.gmail.com> <20170302105206.15fc3886@echo.ms.redpill-linpro.com> <CAKD1Yr2AYaAQMuGZiKXYwKdgz1dzKs5fc5bm7hQjpuq3O_V8gQ@mail.gmail.com> <20170302121104.36ddda4e@echo.ms.redpill-linpro.com> <CAKD1Yr1cNihxMVHjY2j7mcCNU2TE0X6-0p2mDNCBVVUcUbU20Q@mail.gmail.com> <20170302153611.36506f85@envy> <CAKD1Yr1SbdE-i-oGhi2kEFBWTOi_-FzgVdMYkMWjCEtw0MRRMg@mail.gmail.com> <ee3b73b1-64fd-6fef-bc0a-53b325f0bcfd@gmail.com> <alpine.DEB.2.02.1703021902010.30226@uplift.swm.pp.se> <efe2504e-198c-36ce-c79f-be1886e5d031@gmail.com> <alpine.DEB.2.02.1703021929170.30226@uplift.swm.pp.se> <7338F75E-94D9-4330-99C5-C5A9D7B0A066@consulintel.es> <8c848dd1-ceab-887c-5348-2b1bd9920bfa@gmail.com> <367D5BA9-F588-4F2B-A783-2C8BAF9B27BF@consulintel.es> <b6ff1b86-698c-0b8f-6a08-7d6bf8a33c8f@gmail.com> <E2709C92-4C32-4E1C-A8A1-B6B98F0BF336@consulintel.es>
From: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
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Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2017 21:23:56 +0100
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Le 02/03/2017 à 20:25, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ a écrit :
> I understood from one of your previous emails that 3GPP doesn’t
> require DHCPv6-PD.

Right - if I understand correctly, it does not require DHCPv6-PD on the
UE.  Maybe in the core, but not in the UE.

> RFC6653, suggest its use, so probably we got confused ourselves and
> 3GPP is actually using it.
>
> 6rd is a different thing, because is actually IPv4 link and IPv6 is a
> tunnel, so you typically use DHCP (v4).

I agree.

> In IPv6-only world (including cellular), the WAN link will be
> IPv6-only instead of dual-stack. This is already happening.
>
> If they don’t use it, I guess is the same reason why big vendors
> didn’t implemented yet RDDNS …

I wonder if Windows refusing RDNSS doesn't have somehting to do with its
Teredo; and extending this logic to smartphones: the lack of answers to
DHCPv6-PD issued from the UE may have something to do with 464xlat presence.

Could it be that 464xlat presence on UE makes it that DHCPv6-PD is
impossible on same UE?

> Cellular world is using 464XLAT, and they use DHCPv6-PD. Check
> RFC6877.

I guess you mean cellular stations (like BS, not the User Equipment)
uses DHCPv6-PD within the fixed network.

Because cellular operator I am aware of replies to DHCPv6-PD requests
issued from an User Equipment.

Alex

>
> Saludos, Jordi
>
>
> -----Mensaje original----- De: ipv6 <ipv6-bounces@ietf.org>; en nombre
> de Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>; Responder a:
> <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>; Fecha: jueves, 2 de marzo de 2017,
> 20:15 Para: <ipv6@ietf.org>; Asunto: Re: Objection to
> draft-ietf-6man-rfc4291bis-07.txt
>
>
>
> Le 02/03/2017 à 20:06, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ a écrit :
>> I guess because the lack of DHCPv6-PD support, as you already
>> indicated?
>
> But for deity's sake - DHCPv6-PD is available as open source... it's
> common software.  Just download and install.  The IETF Specs suggest
> it, and the 3GPP specs require it too.
>
> There must be something else making these router equipment
> manufacturers refraining from downloading and installing DHCPv6-PD.
>
>> I think majority of the households and business customers get
>> configured the CPE by means for DHCPv6-PD …
>
> AFAIK my CPE at home does not use DHCPv6-PD, but something based on
> IPv4, like 6rd.  I think it's something developped in-house at that
> particular operator.
>
> Alex
>
>>
>> Saludos, Jordi
>>
>>
>> -----Mensaje original----- De: ipv6 <ipv6-bounces@ietf.org>; en
>> nombre de Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>;
>> Responder a: <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>; Fecha: jueves, 2 de
>> marzo de 2017, 20:02 Para: <ipv6@ietf.org>; Asunto: Re: Objection
>> to draft-ietf-6man-rfc4291bis-07.txt
>>
>>
>>
>> Le 02/03/2017 à 19:54, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ a écrit :
>>> Actually, is not correct that most use /56 for residential.
>>>
>>>> From my last review of the survey, worldwide, 22% use /48, 35%
>>>> use /56, but there is a lot of ISPs (33%) doing it wrong and
>>>> using /64, which of course, we are explaining them that is
>>>> wrong. 10% use “other” sizes.
>>
>> So how comes that households can get /56s but smartphones no?
>>
>> Really there must be something there hidden.
>>
>> Alex
>>
>>>
>>> Full details at:
>>>
>>> https://labs.ripe.net/Members/jordipaletm/results-of-the-ipv6-deployment-survey
>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>> Saludos, Jordi
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Mensaje original----- De: ipv6 <ipv6-bounces@ietf.org>; en
>>> nombre de Mikael Abrahamsson <swmike@swm.pp.se>; Organización:
>>> People's Front Against WWW Responder a: <swmike@swm.pp.se>;
>>> Fecha: jueves, 2 de marzo de 2017, 19:33 Para: Alexandre
>>> Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>; CC: <ipv6@ietf.org>;
>>> Asunto: Re: Objection to draft-ietf-6man-rfc4291bis-07.txt
>>>
>>> On Thu, 2 Mar 2017, Alexandre Petrescu wrote:
>>>
>>>> YEs yes, but how much of that /44 is covering the end-users
>>>> and how much is reserved for interconnnections?
>>>
>>> Nothing. It's /44 to the GGSN/SPGW.
>>>
>>>> Ah great, but I guess few cellular operators (if any?) are
>>>> LIRs. Or maybe that's true and I didnt know.
>>>
>>> You don't know.
>>>
>>>> If all this were that simple and clearcut - there are enough
>>>> /64s out there - then why operators only assign one per one end
>>>> user?
>>>
>>> Because DHCPv6-PD hasn't been implemented in mobile networks yet
>>> (that I know of). So that's all they can do per 3GPP standards.
>>>
>>> Residential rollouts, most use /56 per customer.
>>>
>>>> From the RIRs, you can without further justification get /48
>>>> per "site",
>>> so if you show up to RIR and you're LIR and you say "hello, I
>>> have 40 million customers and I want to give each customer a /48"
>>> then they'll give you a /22 most likely. You're perfectly within
>>> your right as an operator to deploy /48 per customer per current
>>> RIR rules that I am aware of.
>>>
>>> -- Mikael Abrahamsson    email: swmike@swm.pp.se
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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