Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6"
Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> Tue, 20 October 2020 10:58 UTC
Return-Path: <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E49A73A115E for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 20 Oct 2020 03:58:28 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.424
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.424 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.247, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id W-Uu3KRR9WpW for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 20 Oct 2020 03:58:27 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from oxalide-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr (oxalide-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr [132.168.224.13]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D5E7C3A115A for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Tue, 20 Oct 2020 03:58:26 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (pisaure.intra.cea.fr [132.166.88.21]) by oxalide-sys.extra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id 09KAwNO8002128; Tue, 20 Oct 2020 12:58:23 +0200
Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id AD42F203CC7; Tue, 20 Oct 2020 12:58:23 +0200 (CEST)
Received: from muguet2-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr (muguet2-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr [132.166.192.13]) by pisaure.intra.cea.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EE83201E1A; Tue, 20 Oct 2020 12:58:23 +0200 (CEST)
Received: from [10.8.35.150] (is154594.intra.cea.fr [10.8.35.150]) by muguet2-sys.intra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id 09KAwNi6022900; Tue, 20 Oct 2020 12:58:23 +0200
Subject: Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6"
To: sarikaya@ieee.org
Cc: 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>
References: <a8dc258cca214efd902a717e08c5bda0@boeing.com> <CAC8QAcfWVN4om0GPC2JnqtBxW5CdOzARK_x25Mw5=Pgv38DTEw@mail.gmail.com> <9c940e46-d865-e7c6-3fa9-9b59a957a91b@gmail.com> <CAC8QAccob_d=NuSntb-E1-=gZ0WEJum4DGAjQMGZjq6Tx7NKBg@mail.gmail.com>
From: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e314a142-bb86-2646-f21a-d5aa645cb0b1@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2020 12:58:23 +0200
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.3.2
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <CAC8QAccob_d=NuSntb-E1-=gZ0WEJum4DGAjQMGZjq6Tx7NKBg@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Language: fr
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ipv6/6u710SBZ_04dIQ1AENPbZmwgOqA>
X-BeenThere: ipv6@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "IPv6 Maintenance Working Group \(6man\)" <ipv6.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ipv6>, <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ipv6/>
List-Post: <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6>, <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2020 10:58:29 -0000
Le 19/10/2020 à 21:17, Behcet Sarikaya a écrit : > > > On Mon, Oct 19, 2020 at 11:12 AM Alexandre Petrescu > <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com <mailto:alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>> wrote: > > > > Le 19/10/2020 à 17:58, Behcet Sarikaya a écrit : > > > > > > On Mon, Oct 19, 2020 at 10:20 AM Templin (US), Fred L > > <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> > <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>>> > > wrote: > > > > Seems like an “IPv6-over-foo” document might be in order; anyone care > > to____ > > > > join me on that?____ > > > > __ > > > > > > IPv6-over-foo on Starlink section would look like > > > > TBD until more is revealed > > One in USA could look at the regulator's public database and find which > frequency channel is allocated for Tesla for Starlink. > > > > It is 12GHz > > From that, one > could find which encoders are available on that frequency. From that > one could find which protocols are on it. It makes for a 'foo' in 'IPv6 > over foo'. The link layer. > > > I don't know how to do these? One would ask the ATN email list of IETF, to find which protocol runs on Starlink satellite links? Or maybe which protocol runs on typical cheap data on satellite links? Because there was already a draft posted there about links for aeronautics draft-maeurer-raw-ldacs-04 One would also ask the email list of the DRIP WG of IETF because that involves drones around air traffic control, which might depend peripherally on satellite data links. One would check the user guides of devices implementing data communications on satellite links. It's true that the name of a device is somehow difficult to find. An old example is Q4000 made by Quake Global. It is an old device that I studied about 10 years ago. It uses RS-232 over the satellite link. That would be the 'encoder'. That means one could put Serial Line Internet Protocol (SLIP) on it. IPv6 works ok over SLIP, even though there is no RFC for it. One might take advantage of the situation to write one. The user manual of that device is at https://fccid.io/PB596XXCS/User-Manual/Datasheet-Q4000-1626630 Another device is Gateworks' current modem for Iridium, the "GW16130 Mini-PCIe Satellite Modem - Datasheet". It is at 1.6GHz (not 12GHz). That mentions 'UART' which again is an 'encoder' to me. Among the features it says 'Supports E-mail messages or HTTP POST'. That means it might support IP. It also says 'Max Message payload: 340 bytes upload, 270 bytes download'. That means if one wants to put IPv6 minimum MTU 1280 bytes then one might need to implement IPv6 Fragmentation extension headers. During these searches I found that maybe SpaceX launched devices for Iridium in the past, so it might be that current Starlink are acting a little bit like Iridium, or so. But it is all speculations. Alex > > Behcet > > Alex > > > > > > Behcet > > > > __ > > > > Fred____ > > > > __ __ > > > > *From:*Behcet Sarikaya [mailto:sarikaya2012@gmail.com > <mailto:sarikaya2012@gmail.com> > > <mailto:sarikaya2012@gmail.com <mailto:sarikaya2012@gmail.com>>] > *Sent:* Monday, October 19, 2020 > > 8:14 AM *To:* Michael Richardson <mcr@sandelman.ca > <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca> > > <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca>>>; 6man WG > <ipv6@ietf.org <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org> > > <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org>>> *Cc:* Templin > (US), Fred L > > <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> > <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>>> > > *Subject:* Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6"____ > > > > __ __ > > > > ____ > > > > Thanks Michael, I'd like to know as much as possible how IPv6 works > > in Starlink.____ > > > > __ __ > > > > Behcet____ > > > > __ __ > > > > On Fri, Oct 16, 2020 at 3:47 PM Michael Richardson > <mcr@sandelman.ca <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca> > > <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca>>> wrote:____ > > > > Anyone read anything more specific about what Starlink is doing that > > is "simpler than IPv6"? > > > > I'd sure like to know that it permits end-terminal to end-terminal > > communicatons without a trip through a data center. > > > > -- ] Never tell me the odds! | ipv6 > > mesh networks [ ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works > > | IoT architect [ ] mcr@sandelman.ca > <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca> <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca > <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca>> > > http://www.sandelman.ca/ <http://www.sandelman.ca/> > <http://www.sandelman.ca/ <http://www.sandelman.ca/>> | ruby on > > rails [ > > > > > > ____ > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > IETF IPv6 working group mailing list ipv6@ietf.org > <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org> Administrative > > Requests: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6 > <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6> > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > IETF IPv6 working group mailing list > ipv6@ietf.org <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org> > Administrative Requests: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6 > <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6> > -------------------------------------------------------------------- >
- Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (OMNI) Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Robert Moskowitz
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Fred Baker
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Mark Smith
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Mark Smith
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… 神明達哉
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Bob Hinden
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Fernando Gont
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Fernando Gont
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… 神明達哉
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Philip Homburg
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Philip Homburg
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Bob Hinden
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Philip Homburg
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Ted Hardie
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Ole Troan
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Manfredi (US), Albert E
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Bob Hinden
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Vasilenko Eduard
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- RE: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Michael Richardson
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Philip Homburg
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Michael Richardson
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Philip Homburg
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu