Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2]
Philip Homburg <pch-ipv6-ietf-6@u-1.phicoh.com> Thu, 12 November 2020 11:55 UTC
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To: ipv6@ietf.org
Subject: Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2]
From: Philip Homburg <pch-ipv6-ietf-6@u-1.phicoh.com>
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References: <CAD6AjGR-NE_sJ_jp7nAT6OvNkcdE9qoWuGEiiVW7r9YtsQvbbw@mail.gmail.com> <CAKD1Yr0G8PjzE+pULte_AaOi=RHMLyto-YUQerGjQ=iOYnz+iA@mail.gmail.com> <0986B112-2159-4045-87F9-876B58F1D896@employees.org> <CAKD1Yr0h9=7p+n=qnH1o1EHqtPrsaYebgvHciOJpP3=iXgNgKQ@mail.gmail.com> <0C739112-D8EA-42C3-BEFD-88C014D5BCD0@employees.org> <62bc0e56-85b8-42ea-c46b-4f2205dc435f@joelhalpern.com> <28C2E56B-1443-480A-B3D1-82E0F8CC0EC7@employees.org> <aabd41ad-1770-f2ac-77d6-62bfff1992c0@joelhalpern.com> <CC7C2B94-5A05-4682-8367-9072CC201C49@employees.org> <80ed3a3b-6e2c-188f-4c1e-c2ededfbbe0d@joelhalpern.com> <0188AC41-60B0-4BC6-810D-DC59CF9E4FB3@employees.org> <1931a638-64ed-f40e-07a3-67cf1eafb941@joelhalpern.com> <376D6BB0-87E2-42E5-9BC4-F3A2F04FA005@employees.org> <CAD6AjGSr-TPcGo7f9EGgoAahYLQTL68CUSq58LGMgD0=6GmRRg@mail.gmail.com> <8DC674FB-9F90-4C41-A323-62BD62934A12@employees.org> <CAD6AjGTYBs8YbHgCJJG84vgwXK4ZSCm65z6KXvZP9F+LdT_atg@mail.gmail.com> <038A830C-E024-42C6-917E-E6FF57829A1C@employees.or g> <CAD6AjGTQVtJBJ3=aZBsF1WcdSK2k9b1hzeZXM6008w_2vpo6_w@mail.gmail.com> <948ACA2B-E45C-4289-A837-9F2536F20F8F@employees.org> <CAKD1Yr0tDTSH2F4=ZsdMJREy1k6equ9mZV0Au1bJPmKuzxeYVA@mail.gmail.com> <43C449AD-D116-4452-A4F2-79AE5A76539F@employees.org> <m1kcoXQ-0000G1C@stereo.hq.phicoh.net> <267D8461-47EC-443A-98DF-4FE990138B5A@employees.org> <m1kcprv-0000GNC@stereo.hq.phicoh.net> <F39272F7-EBCC-4551-BB42-4014DD437302@employees.org> <m1kcr9K-0000GNC@stereo.hq.phicoh.net> <024A7514-57F0-40E0-B445-572DFD007ED4@employees.org> <m1kd9tw-0000KiC@stereo.hq.phicoh.net> <165C6F07-F502-43C7-8542-829FEC041DC1@employees.org>
In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 12 Nov 2020 11:47:19 +0100 ." <165C6F07-F502-43C7-8542-829FEC041DC1@employees.org>
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 2020 12:55:14 +0100
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ipv6/Hj1lSGRibE59ZaDWgUqw5i4uJYg>
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> You seem to be making an argument for why everyone else should > deploy IPv6. Which isn't my point. My point was that IPv6 with > ephemeral addressing gives equal or less benefit to the end-user > than existing IPv4. And no, there is little indication that we > cannot make the IPv4 Internet work forever. If we must. It seems to be that the industry thought that they could make IPv4 work forever. But in reality there was no plan. Life behind a CGN is very limiting. At the same time, our attempts to provide stable addresses have failed. Mobile IP never got tracktion. The same applies to LISP. There is SHIM6. Now we have OMNI. Yes, if you really want statics addresses, you get a PA, find an ISP who is willing to announce your prefix and done. For everybody else, prefixes change. > > When each link has its own /64 then on wifi each time a device connects it > > will get a different address (unless 802.1X is used with radius to assign a > > static prefix to an account). > > Then you didn't understand that proposal. I think I do. Your proposal talks about wireless "Is a wireless network a hub and spoke network?" but in reality it considers only a static wired ethernet. In my experience, computers that are permantly attached to a wired ethernet are servers. Servers tend to get static addresses. I'm not aware of serious issues of assigning address to servers, or routing traffic to them. In multi-tenant sitations, vlans are used to separate traffic. Where we do have issues is with ND multicast on wireless, which could be solved by treating the wireless as a series of point-to-point links. However, there is no such thing as a stable 'Virtual-P2PEthernet0' in wireless unless explicitly created using 802.1X. > > So it not clear to me why you are complaining about shortlived addresses. > > I'm all in favour of making renumbering work. Even to the extent > of ephemeral addressing. But glossing over the problem and pretending > that it is a solved problem, is quite unfair. Have a look at the > existing work on this. E.g. RFC7010. 6man works at the network layer. So we should take a look at the network layer problems described in RFC 7010 Section 5. Other groups can work on transport or applications.
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- Re: 64share v2 Lorenzo Colitti
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- Re: 64share v2 Mark Smith
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- Re: 64share v2 Lorenzo Colitti
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- Re: 64share v2 Mikael Abrahamsson
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- Re: 64share v2 Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: 64share v2 Ca By
- Re: 64share v2 Joel M. Halpern
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- Re: 64share v2 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: 64share v2 otroan
- Re: 64share v2 Joel M. Halpern
- Re: 64share v2 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: 64share v2 Bob Hinden
- Re: 64share v2 otroan
- Re: 64share v2 Joel M. Halpern
- Re: 64share v2 otroan
- Re: 64share v2 Ca By
- Re: 64share v2 Joel M. Halpern
- Re: 64share v2 Joel Halpern
- Re: 64share v2 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: 64share v2 otroan
- Re: 64share v2 Ca By
- Re: [SUSPECTED SPAM] 64share v2 otroan
- Re: [SUSPECTED SPAM] 64share v2 Ca By
- Re: 64share v2 Brian E Carpenter
- Re: 64share v2 Joel M. Halpern
- Re: 64share v2 Ca By
- Re: 64share v2 Philip Homburg
- Re: 64share v2 Brian E Carpenter
- Re: 64share v2 Ca By
- Re: 64share v2 Brian E Carpenter
- Re: 64share v2 Erik Kline
- Re: 64share v2 otroan
- Re: 64share v2 Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: 64share v2 Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: 64share v2 otroan
- Re: 64share v2 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: 64share v2 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: 64share v2 Philip Homburg
- Re: 64share v2 Mikael Abrahamsson
- Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] otroan
- Re: 64share v2 otroan
- Re: 64share v2 Philip Homburg
- Re: 64share v2 Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: 64share v2 Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: 64share v2 Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: 64share v2 otroan
- RE: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Vasilenko Eduard
- Re: 64share v2 Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Philip Homburg
- Re: 64share v2 Philip Homburg
- Re: 64share v2 Philip Homburg
- Re: 64share v2 Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: 64share v2 Philip Homburg
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] otroan
- Re: 64share v2 Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: 64share v2 otroan
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Lorenzo Colitti
- RE: 64share v2 Vasilenko Eduard
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Philip Homburg
- Re: 64share v2 Philip Homburg
- Re: 64share v2 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: 64share v2 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] otroan
- Re: 64share v2 Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Brian E Carpenter
- Re: 64share v2 神明達哉
- Re: 64share v2 Brian E Carpenter
- Re: 64share v2 Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: 64share v2 Brian E Carpenter
- Re: 64share v2 Gyan Mishra
- Re: 64share v2 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: 64share v2 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Philip Homburg
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] otroan
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Philip Homburg
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] otroan
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Philip Homburg
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Fernando Gont
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Fernando Gont
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Fernando Gont
- Re: Ephemeral addressing [was Re: 64share v2] Fernando Gont
- Re: 64share v2 Brian E Carpenter
- Re: 64share v2 Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: 64share v2 Alexandre Petrescu