Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-rfc4291bis-07
Lorenzo Colitti <lorenzo@google.com> Tue, 07 March 2017 06:04 UTC
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From: Lorenzo Colitti <lorenzo@google.com>
Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2017 15:03:56 +0900
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Subject: Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-rfc4291bis-07
To: David Farmer <farmer@umn.edu>
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On Tue, Mar 7, 2017 at 1:56 PM, David Farmer <farmer@umn.edu> wrote: > To be clear no where in the text I provided does it say that an IID other > than 64 is allow. It say 128 bit quantities from manual configuration and > DHCPv6 can be associated with with subnet prefixes of any length. That is > a fine distinction, but no finer that you claiming that requiring that > 64-bit IIDs, and you implying 64-bit subnet prefixes too, doesn't make IPv6 > classful. Are you saying that every implementation of IPv6 that allows > manual config of subnet prefixes other that /64 have it wrong? > Furthermore, if subnet prefixes other than /64 aren't allowed then how do > we have RFC6164 > > I contend that the whole concept of an IID is optional, please note that > RFC4291 and it's predecessor say: "At a minimum, a node may consider that > unicast addresses (including its own) have no internal structure", So I > contend that RFC4291 merely says that if you use an IID it must be 64 bits. > It doesn't directly say that 128bit IPv6 addresses can't be associated with > subnet prefixes other than /64. In fact it also says, "IPv6 unicast > addresses are aggregatable with prefixes of arbitrary bit-length, similar > to IPv4 addresses under Classless Inter-Domain Routing." Which to me > implies that subnets other than /64 have to be valid. Furthermore, RAs are > allowed to be any length, especially if they don't set the "A" flag, why is > this if not to allow subnet prefixes of any length? > Sure. Now let's write all that down in a document so that these subtle (and likely controversial) issues can be fully explained and debated. Because: 1. If these issues are subtle even for us, how can we hope that non-IETF participants (or even just non-WG participants) will understand them? 2. If we don't write them down and just make a change to RFC 4291, how can we know that any decision we make is properly justified. 3. If we don't write them down and just make a change to RFC 4291, how will future IETF participants and network administrators and host implementers know how to interpret the text we write? I don't think asking them to make sense of the 6man archives is reasonable. I can't help fill in the [...] because I personally don't see what you can >> do with a /113 that you can't do with a /64 (other than conserve addresses, >> which has always been a non-goal), but there seem to be several >> participants who do see a problem. What I'm saying is that if we want to >> change the standard, the people who see a problem with it should articulate >> that problem in a way that it's possible to find a solution using informed >> and documented engineering trade-offs rather than opinions. >> > > Just because you can't see it doesn't mean that other can't and don't have > valid uses. > Absolutely agreed. Let's write those uses down, and use them to inform our decision as to how (and whether) we should change the standard.
- A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-rfc42… David Farmer
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Job Snijders
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… David Farmer
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Fred Baker
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… David Farmer
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Mark Smith
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… David Farmer
- Re: A 3rd try at a proposal for draft-ietf-6man-r… Mark Smith