RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (OMNI)
"Templin (US), Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> Thu, 15 October 2020 17:09 UTC
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From: "Templin (US), Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: Philip Homburg <pch-ipv6-ietf-6@u-1.phicoh.com>, "ipv6@ietf.org" <ipv6@ietf.org>
CC: "atn@ietf.org" <atn@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (OMNI)
Thread-Topic: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (OMNI)
Thread-Index: AdaeYhXTsIxJjBX3TKG3GOD4Nt9lNgECC1GAAAsux4AAHPgmBAAAQ58gAAGd5NwAALTH8A==
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 2020 17:09:46 +0000
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References: <c068f71229404b3693b977ca7cde828f@boeing.com> <739bc23a-c48d-4791-be06-4f972b4699d8@si6networks.com> <5ae440c047db4b51811a00fd5dd15e3a@boeing.com> <m1kSzvJ-0000AXC@stereo.hq.phicoh.net> <d0ba7529d30d4a4bb839b1077d52ee9e@boeing.com> <m1kT6Lw-0000HIC@stereo.hq.phicoh.net>
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Philip - see below: > -----Original Message----- > From: atn [mailto:atn-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Philip Homburg > Sent: Thursday, October 15, 2020 9:44 AM > To: ipv6@ietf.org > Cc: Templin (US), Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>; atn@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (OMNI) > > >Thanks for having a look at OMNI; let me know if there are any questions. > > I'll try to spend more time reading the draft. OK, thanks. > >That is the way we had it in older draft versions, but have more recently > >changed to using all of the bits 10 thru 128. The thing that inspired the > >change was the realization that (not now, but in the not too distant > >future) every air, ground, sea and space vehicle on the planet may > >need to use OMNI - pedestrians, too. And, at some point, we may find > >the /64 limit too restricting. > > As long as we are talking about physical devices, I'm not sure how we > are going to run out of /64s. This is a very important point - it is not just about physical devices but also about the arbitrarily complex virtual networks they may have on-board. In the future, even my cellphone could have a deeply-nested virtual IPv6 network-of-networks requiring subnetting and multi-addressing - its turtles all the way down. > Even if that would happen, there are probably lessons learned for an OMNIv2 I'd rather get it right the first time. Thanks - Fred > In the past I would always relate handing out /64s to the number of 48-bit > MAC addresses, which a device typically has to communicate. We are not > even close to running out of those. However, with randomized MACs, it may be > that future ethernet-like interfaces don't need a fixed MAC anymore. > > Do you have a caculations when we would run out of /64 prefixes? Because that > would affect many other parts of IPv6 as well. > > >> 4) However, the main thing standing in the way of using all 118 bits allo= > >wed by > >> the fe80::/10 prefix seems to be the *BSD hack of putting an interface > >> number in the zero bits of a link local address. I think that the BSD > >> communities should remove this hack, and we should not effectively let > >> them squat those bits. > > > >I agree. > > Apart from the fact if there is consensus to make a change in this area, > I guess it will also take quite some time to first mark the bits as reserved, > urging implementations to make sure the support the full fe80::/10 and then > allowing protocols like OMNI to use those bits. > > So it seems to me that it might be better to start with at most a /64 today > and plan for a new version of OMNI that supports longer prefixes. And maybe > just testing if the link local prefix is take from fe80::/64 is enough to > distinguish between the two formats. > > -- > atn mailing list > atn@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/atn
- Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (OMNI) Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Robert Moskowitz
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Fred Baker
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Mark Smith
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Mark Smith
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… 神明達哉
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Bob Hinden
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Fernando Gont
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Fernando Gont
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… 神明達哉
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Philip Homburg
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Philip Homburg
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Bob Hinden
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Philip Homburg
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Ted Hardie
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Ole Troan
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Manfredi (US), Albert E
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Bob Hinden
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Vasilenko Eduard
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- RE: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Michael Richardson
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Philip Homburg
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Michael Richardson
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Philip Homburg
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu