[IPv6]Re: Working Group Last Call for <draft-ietf-6man-pio-pflag>

Jen Linkova <furry13@gmail.com> Tue, 11 June 2024 09:55 UTC

Return-Path: <furry13@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51291C14F696 for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 02:55:51 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -6.858
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.858 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AsmLcuh-6G6n for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 02:55:50 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-lj1-x229.google.com (mail-lj1-x229.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::229]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DEE06C14F6EA for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 02:55:50 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-lj1-x229.google.com with SMTP id 38308e7fff4ca-2ebdfe262feso26872871fa.2 for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 02:55:50 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1718099748; x=1718704548; darn=ietf.org; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=uSO/W4PklXC/Wb1F1laR/xufdqjheqHpNS7Dd7X/huA=; b=YgBvQHsaWdBW9USTG1TWntpIiedagEIAPGR6nCiZakMVOvlRnsi/CsTDKTp9HTX84d Ou4v2dET6BbwYjCj2qN97NfVKDk0lkgGJpDVKDqoH/cNQkiYzwm/3W17ZspILBU+JCqd l1S1YL4MvBEwgdDS3/ww7NVHeYG36lZ4bS4nGa7ioErVibEFO8rmxENdbIMkkLG2DkCX GhdmEyNBhPU6ntGxJEOv6zdKOI3bKWUdkVvSIeI3pjsWNUX9Ay8ojgKpY+ZiSE6GWdGR DlU3hd14VuvT0tWEotf79aJ7l0bXeEAzUpez72Dv+enoBZNPq1DFG2ArT+J+7z5NziRn CcgA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1718099748; x=1718704548; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=uSO/W4PklXC/Wb1F1laR/xufdqjheqHpNS7Dd7X/huA=; b=rsxDGQaVMAIPqGjs9R1qgNd1YI1imdIXuhc4Lhw5MWjOLSf1cXP7LjNmlXK56XD9zN 3kFFmPqYbnPVsyUyE+oB/I585dHQtW6MJHAEX1tipy5EgjDo4xMgt8UEu826KvKVI8s2 y6LNCaWPIvdEC1XqNOqjklGKB6OXtPdF/4BeYEXVkX6HoQ7vOtJt2rIayiNvQBxQ3UAF WKyHvK8GH41Vz6yDb23V3lEC3K6BykRggw+8nPxAZ+KuKsQDu1O6/PHL/C53I/syx4mQ jSYjh7SMNjpK3fgUXhLbesJ5lVRz8UYxl2opYoITuh/l0rIWSX9J5zuIr5dj9KGOSgfr eGFw==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCUR9ZQqgqZM7HYMm4vYPWYQhqEdn9suPr6/k54kMxJN5nlMrXVxZm3EYE53M6gjkiTodjVI07IXFs4CwjvZ
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YwyYbxHmQGVFZMSdlKHrk9zKSxA2wYY+oi5hKRXShTuCpShFThF ZAFDtNy7ZOQJ5P6+7iEJiqNBdSZ5CUHZtLwenzux7Y4D92lVW5QcC75UGZM9O/wugb8HuSNT9Iy My2d2eP5GOLkR4XgkvlsLxFoJwKjRLxzngv8=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IHEvY3Fz93YU8tGOckcRctK6bXIKhVcSIpS6l7XqwMndrO38jxa8oddnuJpOw10M7iQNRhOXbt5/uRPsh87868=
X-Received: by 2002:a05:651c:211b:b0:2eb:d94b:1d3a with SMTP id 38308e7fff4ca-2ebd94b20c3mr64832721fa.40.1718099748149; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 02:55:48 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <18236.1717011844@obiwan.sandelman.ca> <2AD87DE1-075E-45E7-A682-8042F04EF59A@employees.org> <89dbde8c-82c9-4a2e-9cff-8d4fd2d8fbe6@gmail.com> <9E7BEA1C-4597-4142-A3AB-57211C436197@employees.org> <CAKD1Yr0iR+RZHvuquCGYfntiD+K7-PdkvGJzHLx1PLrFqJ=Z4Q@mail.gmail.com> <47BF97B8-2BEE-47CC-A965-C6BB112990AB@employees.org> <4bcfcd71-d295-433d-813f-1183c7da3cf3@gmail.com> <CAKD1Yr1CL_Jw4O-iETF6T1v8EL_Lj-fMi6EV=3MgPhN+M2tc8w@mail.gmail.com> <84f6e699-5587-4407-a566-b031c31e2cd5@gmail.com> <CAMGpriWqD99OzdOaJU7_nQTwvD=o1wsVxOQrbMqy5sH7sX7gwA@mail.gmail.com> <95dfd2e9-25da-4449-b740-724804a34735@gmail.com> <CAKr6gn12Vq9xJWGH+Na6xhDXXsW2XSDCnLegjXMRLN8KJ2CEZQ@mail.gmail.com> <CAKD1Yr24RyW_oxhY3iz5nEdXd0EZENy9cZBo7tfxLqLLMHOX_g@mail.gmail.com> <e2e406e1-1231-4c28-8163-c0e220da7453@lear.ch> <b8f85b39-0167-4040-a5d4-3a97f8819b99@gmail.com> <E50531BE-5867-472A-91FE-739341545D62@employees.org> <CAKD1Yr3uHmaSZ7A74X8TJrx6z39ed6DAbOgEXXnOkBiZtQ=WEw@mail.gmail.com> <CAN-Dau1hhR-nHGoR5KzHgwxyF-S5Q=VwnFmhJzeJDQfuaOUe+Q@mail.gmail.com> <CAKD1Yr34jwMdY=A+PCpjkMKb9v-bT9dr9TThv415tnka3MKeFg@mail.gmail.com> <CAN-Dau2yeRE=_XKz9Cx_h7N+NVwyn_c=HHh0HD0M4xnvYbMQkA@mail.gmail.com> <CAFU7BAQGe0md8cqEF8UgeBfb7XE1TuO+p_yCyu06jA2Ft7Pb8g@mail.gmail.com> <372FA47C-EABC-4236-A8B5-85F13B37FF5E@employees.org>
In-Reply-To: <372FA47C-EABC-4236-A8B5-85F13B37FF5E@employees.org>
From: Jen Linkova <furry13@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2024 19:55:36 +1000
Message-ID: <CAFU7BARdoGHCMLh0p0tSc4me3Q1rKFCt7Q=fjeYDzEvGTH6zKw@mail.gmail.com>
To: Ole Troan <otroan@employees.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-ID-Hash: WWWUIVETPHUHIG6U2VIEXKINI7P5R7FD
X-Message-ID-Hash: WWWUIVETPHUHIG6U2VIEXKINI7P5R7FD
X-MailFrom: furry13@gmail.com
X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-ipv6.ietf.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header
CC: David Farmer <farmer=40umn.edu@dmarc.ietf.org>, Lorenzo Colitti <lorenzo=40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org>, 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>
X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.9rc4
Precedence: list
Subject: [IPv6]Re: Working Group Last Call for <draft-ietf-6man-pio-pflag>
List-Id: "IPv6 Maintenance Working Group (6man)" <ipv6.ietf.org>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ipv6/SsQukpMLmj_tx52FI8T0wRWW_dA>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ipv6>
List-Help: <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Owner: <mailto:ipv6-owner@ietf.org>
List-Post: <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:ipv6-join@ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:ipv6-leave@ietf.org>

On Tue, Jun 11, 2024 at 6:29 PM Ole Troan <otroan@employees.org> wrote:
> > IMHO the very important thing here is that the P flag indicates to the
> > client that the client can request a prefix *short enough* for SLAAC.
> > The goal is to prevent a client to ask for a short prefix if the
> > network supports PD in general but doesn't have enough space for such
> > clients.
> > Clients which need long prefixes (/120../80 whatever) can just do it
> > any time, I'm not sure there is any need for signalling support for an
> > arbitrary long prefix.
>
> On the other thread I saw quite a lot of support for not having that restriction.

I'd not call it a restriction. If the network supports PD, and the
client needs /120 - why does the network need to signal it?
The client can just ask for a prefix and get it.
It's completely different for SLAAC-suitable prefixes, hence this document.

> The P-flag means, “don’t autoconfigure an address using this PIO if you can get addresses via PD instead”.
> And for that use case, SLAAC is not used.

It can be, if the host uses the prefix to form SLAAC addresses.
Anyway, I believe we have had this discussion when
draft-ietf-v6ops-dhcp-pd-per-device was discussed.

> SLAAC could be used for network extensions. But only in very limited topologies, so cannot be an general solution.

If by 'a general solution' you mean 'smth that every host MUST use' -
then it cannot be indeed. If by 'a general solution' we mean 'smth
that every host can use' - then why not?

If we want to signal a general availability of a PD with an arbitrary
prefix length etc - maybe we need an RA option (or a PVD one) which
would be saying 'this network can give you /X via PD' (multihoming
would still be tricky though).

-- 
Cheers, Jen Linkova