Re: [v6ops] A proposal for draft-ietf-6man-rfc4291bis-07 - timeline

Mark Andrews <marka@isc.org> Fri, 10 March 2017 02:37 UTC

Return-Path: <marka@isc.org>
X-Original-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D21BC1294C3 for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 9 Mar 2017 18:37:50 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -6.902
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.902 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LPt87jUZqoXG for <ipv6@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 9 Mar 2017 18:37:48 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mx.pao1.isc.org (mx.pao1.isc.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:0:2::2b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F13501294E0 for <ipv6@ietf.org>; Thu, 9 Mar 2017 18:37:42 -0800 (PST)
Received: from zmx1.isc.org (zmx1.isc.org [149.20.0.20]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx.pao1.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3F1413497CB; Thu, 9 Mar 2017 22:40:19 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from zmx1.isc.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zmx1.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1AAB4160091; Thu, 9 Mar 2017 22:40:19 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zmx1.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED258160090; Thu, 9 Mar 2017 22:40:18 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from zmx1.isc.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zmx1.isc.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id tHbmyFY3_1o3; Thu, 9 Mar 2017 22:40:18 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from rock.dv.isc.org (c27-253-115-14.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au [27.253.115.14]) by zmx1.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7F80E16008F; Thu, 9 Mar 2017 22:40:18 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from rock.dv.isc.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rock.dv.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C436665FFBC; Fri, 10 Mar 2017 09:40:14 +1100 (EST)
To: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
From: Mark Andrews <marka@isc.org>
References: <CAN-Dau17q_BrUuzfvB1mLDt6p5UxYikphWaHpa8VQ2L-3kx-DA@mail.gmail.com> <5B4AFF50-8CA9-4134-8CE2-A383DB5F8BF5@google.com> <m1ckxfo-0000IMC@stereo.hq.phicoh.net> <225F639E-27C1-4408-BC2B-26500929049B@google.com> <CAOSSMjUR203+hYFBrFBrj9Xkjux3o7fYNd4y9kNyxwpLxF11ew@mail.gmail.com> <6D825351-7F43-4540-89AB-48DC2B5E92E3@google.com> <CAOSSMjUP6m-L1iNhE=BxHW+7hvt4YsZgxxtVn+qmgEVS9HeStA@mail.gmail.com> <3EC22050-D159-488D-A354-E46F04764E25@google.com> <CAOSSMjW_fPz3RdPyK=e-EyvyW4GawFAr3zcGLkBzDcR8Ws2MUw@mail.gmail.com> <90292C5E-013D-4B7C-B496-8A88C7285CD7@google.com> <CAOSSMjXf1ah6nrAorf+mpnOxXBpHg6difgCo4mQ6rPVZoU8CSw@mail.gmail.com> <7FAD8D2B-B50E-44C5-AAA3-0C91621D9D54@google.com> <CAOSSMjX4Rq969cTuAU+sqWmW7Rh2-nxjd1vpSkeAevVZTed1HA@mail.gmail.com> <ED8E5513-A522-4D37-A0A2-0960CF3E5394@google.com> <36251EE1-309C-44B5-BEAE-591889492547@employees.org> <9B6D49C1-D793-465B-A395-28147BD22FAC@google.com> <CAOSSMjUy2=yguYh6iMmd6O6d91WrdNEFgo9Gn+4urVp33vug2Q@mail.gmail.com> <3397bed0-1 ca8-7b62-8215-7561883de4a9@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [v6ops] A proposal for draft-ietf-6man-rfc4291bis-07 - timeline
In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 09 Mar 2017 08:58:38 +0100." <3397bed0-1ca8-7b62-8215-7561883de4a9@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2017 09:40:14 +1100
Message-Id: <20170309224014.7C436665FFBC@rock.dv.isc.org>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ipv6/YJuwe_VoAQ2ldBB5-f5CafRuDwg>
Cc: ipv6@ietf.org
X-BeenThere: ipv6@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17
Precedence: list
List-Id: "IPv6 Maintenance Working Group \(6man\)" <ipv6.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ipv6>, <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ipv6/>
List-Post: <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6>, <mailto:ipv6-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2017 02:37:51 -0000

In message <3397bed0-1ca8-7b62-8215-7561883de4a9@gmail.com>;, Alexandre Petrescu writes:
> Hi,
> 
> Thanks for the pointers to the earlier discussion.
> 
> Le 08/03/2017 =E0 22:54, Timothy Winters a =E9crit :
> > Hi James,
> >
> > Since this was added in the update from RFC 2461 to 4861 I went to
> > go look for why this was added and found the following thread.
> >
> > Discussion:
> > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/search/?email_list=3Dipv6&q=3DRequireme=
> nt+for+64bit+I%2FF+ID&so=3Ddate&gbt=3D1&index=3DrJtLf5Krh0X9vg3vYts_xO1oUCw
> >
> >
> >
> >
> Final Decision:
> > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ipv6/IfWdv79U0k9PbwK6-lAIk4yeyK4
> 
> I think that decision is that ND should work with arbitrary plens, not
> just 64.
> 
> In light of that ND decision, it is strange to see an RFC at the same
> time IPv6 Addressing Architecture mandating IIDs 64 (and implicit
> mathematical plen 128).
> 
> Retrospectively:
> 
> At time of that discussion, year 2004, there was no IPv6 on cellular
> links, [I-D]. Since then 3GPP got many recommendations from IETF about
> how to run IPv6. The result is 3GPP User Equipment links only support a
> single 64 today.
>
> My supposition, and many indications converge, is that the 64
> recommendation from the IPv6 Addressing Architecture RFC led to this
> undesirable situation of a single 64 for an UE.

No.  The deliberate decision to ignore DHCP-PD lead to it.  It was too
new / too late in the process / not enough implementations / not enough
experience.

> If we were again in 2004, I would tell that decision maker: not only ND
> should avoid the 64 limit, but the IPv6 Addressing Archi should too.
> 
> That would have saved us many recent RFCs discussing 64 (the BCP CIDR
> IPv6, the multiple-address per Host recommendation, the why64 RFC, and
> many others I mistakenly forgot).
> 
> We are now in 2017...
> 
> Alex
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> IETF IPv6 working group mailing list
> ipv6@ietf.org
> Administrative Requests: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
-- 
Mark Andrews, ISC
1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia
PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742                 INTERNET: marka@isc.org