Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (OMNI)
Bob Hinden <bob.hinden@gmail.com> Sat, 17 October 2020 16:47 UTC
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From: Bob Hinden <bob.hinden@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (OMNI)
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 2020 09:47:25 -0700
In-Reply-To: <49d4846dc5cf43e8921fe02d63810437@boeing.com>
Cc: Bob Hinden <bob.hinden@gmail.com>, "Manfredi (US), Albert E" <albert.e.manfredi@boeing.com>, IPv6 List <ipv6@ietf.org>, Ole Trøan <otroan@employees.org>, "atn@ietf.org" <atn@ietf.org>
To: "Templin (US), Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
References: <81c2b0adda744231ae790408dcb594a2@boeing.com> <C38A7B84-6451-42C3-925D-09BEDBA319AD@employees.org> <053deb1bf9c149df98ad3e75d60bfe93@boeing.com> <312E6A75-75D7-409D-85FB-6ACCBA2474F3@gmail.com> <49d4846dc5cf43e8921fe02d63810437@boeing.com>
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Fred, > On Oct 17, 2020, at 9:01 AM, Templin (US), Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> wrote: > > Bob, it looks like our notes crossed at approximately the same time, but I would say > the same thing to you that I just said to Bert - we will want all four of LLAs (for the > control plane), SLAs (for the OAL) and ULAs/GUAs (for end-system addressing). I think we are saying you are asking for too much. > > About your scale calculations, there will be far more terrestrial vehicles, urban > air mobility vehicles, drones, pedestrians etc. than there are the number of > aircraft currently worldwide. But, scale is just one dimension of the problem > space and the more important dimension is *function*. Where is the problem statement for this? This is far beyond what was I understood was called for in the OMNI liaison letter (https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1676/ ) that we thought the OMNI draft was focused on. The liaison letter talks about aircraft, not vehicles, drones, pedestrians, etc. I read what you are saying is a mobility solution for everything. Bob > > Thanks - Fred > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: atn [mailto:atn-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bob Hinden >> Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2020 8:52 AM >> To: Manfredi (US), Albert E <albert.e.manfredi@boeing.com> >> Cc: IPv6 List <ipv6@ietf.org>; Ole Trøan <otroan@employees.org>; Bob Hinden <bob.hinden@gmail.com>; atn@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (OMNI) >> >> Bert, >> >>> On Oct 16, 2020, at 2:47 PM, Manfredi (US), Albert E <albert.e.manfredi@boeing.com> wrote: >>> >>> From: ipv6 <ipv6-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Ole Troan >>> >>>> I would challenge you to make OMNI entirely free from semantic addresses. That would also help the working group understand >> what benefits semantic addresses bring to OMNI. And what the tradeoffs would be. >>> >>> I think it's a matter of speed and simplicity, no? You avoid that extra protocol, to assign addresses. Same idea as embedding the MAC >> into the IPv6 address. But it's true that the IETF likes to stay away from semantic addresses. >>> >>> The path of least resistance, from all the back and forth, as of now, seems to be to either use ULAs, or to request a new /10 for this >> new purpose. >> >> I did some searching, found that there are currently about 500K aircraft of all types (general aviation, commercial, military, etc.). >> Allocating a /10 seems excessive to me for this even with a lot of growth. >> >> Using ULAs would be fine. This might even be a good justification to use the other half of the ULA space as I suspect the ICAO could >> be an allocation authority. >> >> Bob >> >> >
- Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (OMNI) Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Robert Moskowitz
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Fred Baker
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Mark Smith
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Mark Smith
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… 神明達哉
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Bob Hinden
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Fernando Gont
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Fernando Gont
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… 神明達哉
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Philip Homburg
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Philip Homburg
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… otroan
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Bob Hinden
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information… Philip Homburg
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Ted Hardie
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Ole Troan
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Manfredi (US), Albert E
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Bob Hinden
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Vasilenko Eduard
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in … Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Bob Hinden
- RE: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Michael Richardson
- RE: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Philip Homburg
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: [atn] Embedding IP information in an IPv6 add… Bob Hinden
- Re: Embedding IP information in an IPv6 address (… Michael Richardson
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [atn] Embedding IP information… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Philip Homburg
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Embedding IP information in an… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Embedding IP information in an IPv… Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Behcet Sarikaya
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Bob Hinden
- Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6" Alexandre Petrescu